Undead and Age?

[Elric]

How does being undead interact with aging and ability scores? Obviously, this doesn't apply to Constitution.

If you become undead, can your stats change as a result of aging? Do you get the physical modifiers, mental modifiers, or both?

If you have already aged and become undead, what happens to the ability modifiers? Do your physical modifiers (Str and Dex) remain? Do your mental modifiers (Int, Wis and Cha) remain?

I don't have my books right now, so I apologize if this is explained clearly in the MM or DMG. Thanks for the help!

 

[Gromm]

How does being undead interact with aging and ability scores? Obviously, this doesn't apply to Constitution.

If you become undead, can your stats change as a result of aging? Do you get the physical modifiers, mental modifiers, or both?

If you have already aged and become undead, what happens to the ability modifiers? Do your physical modifiers (Str and Dex) remain? Do your mental modifiers (Int, Wis and Cha) remain?

I don't have my books right now, so I apologize if this is explained clearly in the MM or DMG. Thanks for the help!

Physical stats shouldn't change. Being dead is a much more serious status than being old I'd say. As far as mental stats, it seems to make sense to let them get the bonuses for living so long, though I'd cap it at the maximum age group for the living race.

 

[Magic Rub]

Re: Re: Undead and Age?

Physical stats shouldn't change. Being dead is a much more serious status than being old I'd say. As far as mental stats, it seems to make sense to let them get the bonuses for living so long, though I'd cap it at the maximum age group for the living race.

I agree with Gromm, your mental stats should have a cap. There would come a time when you "naturally" couldn't learn (Int) any more or become any more worldly (wis), withouth magic.

"Memories fade with time"
"He's forgotten more then I'll ever know"

The MM tells you what happens to your stats, when you become a "thinking" undead. Look under the lich & vampire templates. If they are PC's then you'd still get your stat every 4 lvl's, you just wouldn't be able to put it into your Con.

 

[Crothian]

I'd probably double the age they need to get to middle age and those others, but when they did I'd give them the bonuses with none of the minuses. I think they need other ways for old undead to be powerful beisdes just HD advancement or levels.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Really?

Liches and vampires get unlimited advancement by character class, and they live effectively forever compared to normal mortals. Compare this to 1e/2e, where it was pretty clear that neither liches nor vampires could advance in class level (Ravenloft had rules for advancement of powers, but that's different).

Personally, I use White Wolf's 3e RL rules to represent stats advancement for undead as a REPLACEMENT for the aging bonus scores. IMHO, if elves don't get the mental stat bonuses as quickly as humans (or at least nearly so), then an immortal creature should never get them. Template undead nearly always get mental stats bonuses anyway.

 

[Crothian]

Well, the bonuses aging is based off of a races maturity rate. I still think certain races would mature faster as an undead after they become on. Also, at the very most it's only +3 to three stats. I don't think that is very much to worry about at all.

However, if given the option I'd perfer to use the RL versions.

 

[Magic Rub]

I agree that the age chart for undead should be mod. to reflect a drastically slower advancement.

However that would effectively make this entire string a null point. Besides how old do PC's "normally" get, really. I mean sure if you play the same PC for 5 - 10 years (?depending how much you play?) in real time, or your campaign moves really fast, then I could see the undead age question as being effective. Generally speaking your PC would never age enough for it to make a difference.

Another point while I'm ranting. . . Let me play devils advocate & say that the aging chart is meant for just living PC's it has negatives & bonuses for the ageing of a living body, or slowly dieing depending on your perspective. With age comes reduced physical abilities & increased mental power. A nicely designed system of checks and balances. If you're playing an undead PC you obviously don't care about say your CON. & it's associated bonus, and there by you are not going to be suffering a negative by ageing because that won't affect you. It's only a bonus then, and not fair to regular PC's. Maybe if there was an experience penalty?
I had an Elf wizard PC that started his adventuring career at a venerable age, however he didn't last very long. Brittle bones, poor cardiovascular, and a touch of senility did him in. It was sad really.

 

[Elric]

What about aging prior to becoming undead? If a 90 year old wizard becomes a lich, does he get his physical stat points back that he lost while aging?

 

[Howling Coyote]

No, I don't think so. Undeath kind of freezes normal aging process. What's happened before has happened and can't be reversed. Your physical stat will generally always be the same as they were when you turned to an undead, even if your body starts to rot and your flesh falling of your bones.
The stat bonuses you get when turning into an undead reflect the thing that you are effectively physically dead. An undead doesn't have to worry about bodily functions or needs like sleep, or hunger (doesn't apply to vampires). They also have all the time in the world, so they tend to see things differently.
So the mental stat boosts reflect that they see things differently, and can ponder things for years almost non-stop. As for physical attribute bonuses, their strength is only limited by how much weight their body can take, not how much muscle they got, same goes for reflexes, because their reflexes are as fast as their mind.
The other way of looking things (the D&D way) is that their bond to the negative energy plane tightens over time, and that’s makes them stronger. Now I kind of like the way RL incorporates different power levels of undead, so I use those rules in all my campaigns to represent undead, with slight modifications of course.