Warforged and the Monk - doable?

[ARandomGod]

Wouldn't another valid analogy be... Wielding a Rapier (d6) and then Enlarged (d8) then given a Longsword (d8)?

That would be more applicable. With the exception that it's ... wielding a dagger (d4) and then enlarged (d6) and then given a longsword (d8)

 

[Cactot]

That would be more applicable. With the exception that it's ... wielding a dagger (d4) and then enlarged (d6) and then given a longsword (d8)

If you are of a size that would have been able to use the longsword in the first place, and you were to increase in size, you would be able to use a larger longsword.
So if your size is medium and you switch from dagger (d4) to longsword (d8) and you are enlarged, would you still use a longsword that is undersized for you? or would you use one of the appropriate size (2d6?)

In the end it is actually rather irrelevant, as in most situations it only adds 1 dice of damage (3.5dmg or 4.5dmg per swing depending on d6 or d8) so either way its not game breaking unless you just combine it in a rediculous fashion. Combine it with Master of many forms, then wildshape into a giant + wildling clasped battlefist + INA + monk levels + righteous might + monks belt and similar magic items. You would end up with something like 16d8 or 24d6 per swing (they dont have tables that go up enough to cover 4 size increases above the damage of a large monk)

But in any other situation like that it is really not much of a big deal, as there are significantly more broken combinations that are perfectly within the rules. And in most situations, other than the rediculous one i just mentioned, the monk in question would still be behind dmg wise compared to a 2h sword using barbarian/fighter or the like, as well as having less hp and AC.

 

[ARandomGod]

If you are of a size that would have been able to use the longsword in the first place, and you were to increase in size, you would be able to use a larger longsword.
So if your size is medium and you switch from dagger (d4) to longsword (d8) and you are enlarged, would you still use a longsword that is undersized for you? or would you use one of the appropriate size (2d6?)

Sure, it's true that if you were actually enlarged, you would be able to use a larger longsword. Too bad they aren't giving you one in the Battlefist, huh?

In the end it is actually rather irrelevant, as in most situations it only adds 1 dice of damage (3.5dmg or 4.5dmg per swing depending on d6 or d8) so either way its not game breaking unless you just combine it in a rediculous fashion.

Oh, I anticipate it being combined in a rediculous fashion. And it will be, believe me.

And I agree, in a non-monk it's not going to really matter if you allow INA and Battlefist to stack, so that all the natural attacks are dealt as if they are two size catagories larger (Although a RAW reading still only has two size catagories larger being d8)

However in a monk it makes a pretty big difference. Especially if you throw in an actual enlarge and having that stack as well...

 

[Zephyrus]

To derail the thread off the Imp. Nat. Atk route for the moment..

+Cold Iron Tracery
+Silver Tracery

+Bracers of armor +8
Plus you could enchant the battlefists and natural armor to have +10 in non-base attack bonuses (aka fortification, invulnerability, silent moves for armor, holy, shocking, frost, flame, ghost touch, and speed for the battlefists).

First, I dont have the book handy... but can you get both tracery's at the same time or does getting one exclude getting the other tracery (I Thouht it was the latter but I dont have the book handy). And I dont really want to start a whole new debate here... but where does it say that the Tracery's can affect unarmed strikes? I thought it only affected the natural attacks (primarly the Slam attacks and I assume also the bite if that feat is taken).

The other issue is why bother with Bracers of armor at all. Bracers are much more expensive than a simple armor enhancement. As for +10 in Non-Base attack.. at best it'll be +9 as your still requried to have a Minimum +1 enHANCEment bonus before you can start applying special properties. It would be less expensive to enhance the Composite Plating with an armor enhancement and add in a few special properties. It might not be as great as Bracers (Armor Bonus of 7 [Base 2 plus +5 Enhancement] vs Bracers AC 8). The only real advantage of going the Bracers of Armor route would be that the Bracers are a force affect and that you could get +9 levels worth of special abilities on the composite plating vs +5 Enhancement and +5 Special Abilities. The latter is alot less expensive and more practical expecially if you consider many of the special abilities in 3.5 have direct GP costs instead of Enhancement level equivalents. In addition the Armor bonus to AC wouldent stack so the +1 Enhancement would have to be paid 'just' so you could add special abilities and their would be no value in having bracers untill the Bracer's AC was at least 4 which is a serious magic item compared to a +2 Enhancement on armor (a mear 4,000 vs 16,000 for Bracers AC 4).

Also, while the Battlefist is all nice and dandy... its also expensive and wouldent it be also better to simple take enhancements directly to the Warforged Monk's fists/hands. Since the Warforged can be enhanced directly their's no magic items to be stolen etc. Yes, it requires someone to do it vs getting it as Treasure but I would figure a Warforged Monk would draw less attention not having a battlefist and being loaded down with magic items.

 

[Klaus]

The tracery feats aren't mutually exclusive by the RAW. IMHO, they affect a monk's unarmed strikes, since the monk's strikes count as natural or manufactured weapons, whatever is more beneficial. If they affect the "the slam", then I'd say no, but they affect "natural weapons".