D&D 5E Warlock, Hex, and Short Rests: The Bag of Rats Problem

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Cast Hex on yourself. Then shift it when an enemy appears. Works well if you are of the good-aligned-but-tricked-or-otherwise-forced-to-deal-with-an-evil-patron persuasion.
I can picture a blood cut of the off hand's palm as a sacrifice/penance first thing in the morning (casting Hex). Visually speaking/narratively I mean.


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[Caliban]

Cast Hex on yourself. Then shift it when an enemy appears. Works well if you are of the good-aligned-but-tricked-or-otherwise-forced-to-deal-with-an-evil-patron persuasion.
I can picture a blood cut of the off hand's palm as a sacrifice/penance first thing in the morning (casting Hex). Visually speaking/narratively I mean.

Unfortunately you can't move your Hex until the creature it is on has been reduced to zero hit points.

 

[Ganymede81]

The other side of the issue is whether you can maintain concentration while taking a short rest, and actually gain the benefits of the short rest. But again, no general or specific rule speaks directly on this specific interaction, so we have to look to the general rules for resting, which are fairly clear. You have to spend an hour doing nothing strenuous. There is no indication anywhere in the rules that concentration is strenuous, and in fact, you can concentrate while doing just about anything, even being stabbed, if you make the check successfully.

So, I'd say it's pretty clear that, by RAW, you can keep concentration during a short rest.

I'd hate to be a broken record here, but the inferences you, doctorbadwolf, draw from the rules are not RAW. That is literally you making a judgment call, which is the opposite of RAW.

 

[werecorpse]

I'd hate to be a broken record here, but the inferences you, doctorbadwolf, draw from the rules are not RAW. That is literally you making a judgment call, which is the opposite of RAW.

Page 203 PHB says that the spell specifies how long you can concentrate - this means concentration can last that long under normal circumstances unless some factor intervenes- and that normal activity such as moving and attacking doesn't interfere with concentration. It also lists certain factors that can break concentration specifically including taking damage, being incapacitated or killed. It says environmental phenomena like being hit by a wave might have an effect.

Page 186 PHB says a short rest is a period of time during which a character does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading and tending wounds.

So RAW it appears to me that the activity allowed in a short rest can't reach the threshold to interfere with concentration - otherwise it's not a short rest.

How can you interpret the activity stated as "the most you can do in a short rest" as interfering with concentration?

 

[Caliban]

Page 203 PHB says that the spell specifies how long you can concentrate - this means concentration can last that long under normal circumstances unless some factor intervenes- and that normal activity such as moving and attacking doesn't interfere with concentration. It also lists certain factors that can break concentration specifically including taking damage, being incapacitated or killed. It says environmental phenomena like being hit by a wave might have an effect.

Page 186 PHB says a short rest is a period of time during which a character does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading and tending wounds.

So RAW it appears to me that the activity allowed in a short rest can't reach the threshold to interfere with concentration - otherwise it's not a short rest.

How can you interpret the activity stated as "the most you can do in a short rest" as interfering with concentration?

Eh, one of the interpretations is RAW, the other isn't. They want to believe it's their interpretation, we want to believe it's our interpretation.

Because the interpretation I use is obviously the most reasonable one, and they are just trying to force their opinion through as RAW.

 

[Ganymede81]

Page 203 PHB says that the spell specifies how long you can concentrate - this means concentration can last that long under normal circumstances unless some factor intervenes- and that normal activity such as moving and attacking doesn't interfere with concentration. It also lists certain factors that can break concentration specifically including taking damage, being incapacitated or killed. It says environmental phenomena like being hit by a wave might have an effect.

Page 186 PHB says a short rest is a period of time during which a character does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading and tending wounds.

So RAW it appears to me that the activity allowed in a short rest can't reach the threshold to interfere with concentration - otherwise it's not a short rest.

You just drew an inference as well. While it might be a reasoned inference, it remains just an inference.

In other words, you gave your own personal interpretation of a set of rules that does not give us an explicit answer. That's perfectly fine, but it ain't RAW.

How can you interpret the activity stated as "the most you can do in a short rest" as interfering with concentration?

I'm not. I'm just pointing out that there is no RAW answer to whether concentrating on a spell is more or less strenuous than "eating, reading, tending to wounds, etc."

Others have provided well-reasoned explanations for why they ruled the opposite position. They are earlier in the thread if you were curious about them.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I'd hate to be a broken record here, but the inferences you, doctorbadwolf, draw from the rules are not RAW. That is literally you making a judgment call, which is the opposite of RAW.

I think you've misunderstood my post. I break the issue down to two parts.

1, whether you can keep concentration through a short rest.

2, whether you can benefit from a short rest *while concentrating*.

I claimed RAW on the first one, not the second.

Because RAW isn't just explicit statements about a specific case. In this case, the general rule is clear, and there is nothing in the rules that contradicts it, so yes, you can keep concentration. The only thing open to interpretation is whether or not you can benefit from the short rest while concentrating.

 

[Ganymede81]

I think you've misunderstood my post. I break the issue down to two parts.

1, whether you can keep concentration through a short rest.

2, whether you can benefit from a short rest *while concentrating*.

I claimed RAW on the first one, not the second.

Sure, but answering the first question doesn't help you answer the second. In fact, I'm really not sure of the relevance of the first question whatsoever.

Warlocks want to know whether they can cast Hex then get their slot back with the short rest while keeping Hex up. How does saying "Reading doesn't disrupt concentration" clarify that?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Sure, but answering the first question doesn't help you answer the second. In fact, I'm really not sure of the relevance of the first question whatsoever.

Warlocks want to know whether they can cast Hex then get their slot back with the short rest while keeping Hex up. How does saying "Reading doesn't disrupt concentration" clarify that?

Are you serious?

It's been apoint of contention in this thread, and it is one half of what has to work for this strategy to work. The warlock must benefit from the short rest, AND maintain concentration through that rest.

I don't understand how you read the post you first responded to, without seeing that part of that post.

just to reiterate, because I'm so confused by your response:

in order to use Hex all day without using a spell slot, the warlock must,

1. Cast Hex as a level 3 spell
1a. Maintain Concentration through all later steps
2. Kill or otherwise reduce the target to 0hp
3. Take a short rest
3a. Gain the mechanical benefits of a short rest
3b. Maintain Concentration through the short rest
4. Carry on your day

so, yes, both questions are relevant.

 

[Ganymede81]

Are you serious?

It's been apoint of contention in this thread, and it is one half of what has to work for this strategy to work. The warlock must benefit from the short rest, AND maintain concentration through that rest.

I don't understand how you read the post you first responded to, without seeing that part of that post.

No. It isn't contentious.

I don't see anyone arguing that "eating, drinking, reading, and tending to wounds" breaks a spellcaster's concentration. Have you seen anyone at all argue this? Even a single person?

The entire crux of the controversy is whether concentrating on a spell is more or less strenuous than "eating, drinking, reading, and tending to wounds."