Well, I might as well ask for some advice.

[Great Mastiff Games]

Many thanks, Annado ... you posted right while I was typing, so that's why my appreciation was delayed! I'm checking out that other web hosting service you recommended even as I'm typing this, in another window. Much appreciated!

 

[Cergorach]

No site is a problem.
Advertisement in Dragon or Dungeon, i look at the pretty pictures and go "Oh-ah! This might be interesting". If you have the money to advertise in those you better have a most impressive eyecatcher, i just grabbed Dragon 323 from the pile and started looking.
Not impressive, not an eyecatcher at all, the top font is near unreadible and the the one image (the cover) is uninspiring if you want to catch my attention. The text under the cover image is so generic that it doesn't say anything about the setting, i could have used that text to push just about any setting. Just not a good ad.

Advertisement on ENworld in the way of posting pdf previes generally generates a lot of interest (the preview should contain artwork).

 

[tjoneslo]

You've hit upon the bane of every small business in the world. How to get name recognition for your company and it's products without any money. I'd say you haven't done anything wrong, but getting recongnised takes more patience and persistance than anything. Some concrete suggestions:

1) Get a web site up ASAP. Keep it updated. Even if you don't produce any more full books, having a fresh site with bits of cool stuff, free downloads and so on will attract people.

2) Frequent several popluar on-line sites (like ENWorld or RPGNet). Make sure your sig includes a link to the website, and a tagline of coolness. Post frequently with helpful advice.

3) Run a game in your world. First thought would be in a FLGS having an open group. Or run a PBEM game. Post the StoryTime in a thread. If some people are having fun playing in the game, they may post their experiences. This is viral marketing. All authors are excited by their own work, but of other people are as well it can attract more attention.

4) Get more reviews published. I go through the reviews on ENWorld, RPGNet, d20Magazine, Pyramid, and a few other sites on a regular basis. A review that reveals that I might like the book (in addition to being 5/5) is likely to attract my attention.

Above all, don't get discouraged. Marketing takes time and effort.

 

[annadobritt]

Once you get the website back up, add some downloads (the downloads don't have to be many pages. A write up about a specific person or place, some interesting creature, sample rules) then make a news announcement to ENWorld, Gaming Report, Mortality.net, Pen and Paper and d20 Magazine Rack.

Remember to place your website in your signature for whatever forums you belong to, I read Dragon magazine, but not Silven Trumpet. Keep your website updated and if possible have a forum there too.

 

[Great Mastiff Games]

Ah, many thanks, just what I needed ... good solid advice (and a spot of encouragement too)!

There's just one interesting note that I'd like to add ... I ran a more snazzy looking advertisement by a bunch of people at the local college who specialize in advertising (part of the business department) and they said to tone it down a lot. In fact, they wanted me to make it primarily grey, brown, and black ... it looks like I should have disregarded them and basically made the ad as bright and striking as I was going to originally. They had some theory about people feeling 'threatened' by my original ad ... and let that be a lesson to me too. All I've heard though, since I started is, "it's too bright." "It's too dull." "You should have a picture." "You shouldn't have a picture." "Your font is too fancy." "Argh, that font is so plain -- looks like something out of a textbook." "More color." "Less color." This aspect is probably the most discouraging part of all, that every change I make in the outward appearance of book, website, ads, etc. seems to be just as displeasing to the critics as the last one. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't, again. I'm not complaining per se, it's just that it's hard to gauge what the public wants when they seem to dislike their own suggested changes just as much as the original look....

As for the text in the ad, my mistake was probably having any text at all. If you look at most of the ads in Dragon, they are just a picture of the item with no description whatsoever. But it's moot, since I can't afford any more Dragon ads at the moment anyway.

However, to return to the topic ... I'll take all of your suggestions, many thanks for the help, and if you think of anything else, please funnel it into my ear!

 

[JimAde]

In my (admittedly limited) experience, the exact form of your message is less important than its consistency. If you can develop a specific "look" and really stick with it, it will help to develop brand recognition more effectively than a single striking ad.

 

[Eosin the Red]

With the deluge of books out right now and the waning interest in d20 in general - added to the fact that you are a first time publisher - and your d20 presence is very low (I have only seen you post here in the publishers section and once or twice your posts caused a bit of a stir) - you have a sure recipe for low sales. If you corrected all of these things, within your power to correct, you might still have low sales.

What can you do right now to help your sales?

1. More reviews - you need at least 5-6 reviews.
2. More time on the front page of ENworld (you need to "make the news")
3. Ensure that the good folks of ENworld (and elsewhere know who you are and want to buy your stuff).
4. Realism - Understand that you may never break even with RPG books in the current market. With 1,000 to 2,000 books being "successful" in todays world it is awfully hard to turn a profit. For a "no name" company to do better you need to put stuff out that is red hot and on fire.
5. Website - professional looking or artsy but make sure it is nice and reflects your book/line.
6. Pimpage - when APPROPRIATE pimp your line to the high hells. Make sure that when people see Great Mastiff posting on the boards they automaticlly hear the title of your book (Joseph Browning of Expeditious Retreat Press is good at this)
7. Join the GPA if not already a member.
8. Understand your target and the advertising medium that serves it. Banner ads work well to raise your profile but don't actually sell many books (according to many discussions that I have seen on the net). You need name recognition.
8A. Dragon is A) Too expensive unless you are a big boy B) Not the right audiance unless your books are on the stands C) Unlikely to generate sales for Great Mastiff.
9. You spent a heck of a lot of time writing the book and a chunk of change having it printed - now you need to do what should have come first, examine marketing and promotion.
9A) Send an email to Hellhound or Phil Reed they are pros who have been known to offer solid advice (Others also fall into this category).
9B) Look throught the last 2 years of threads on the publishers forums (That is what I did).
9C) Buy the e-publishers guide from RPG now, even if you are paper publishing it will serve you well.
9D) Research your market with any means at your disposal, good market comprehension at leasts allows you to understand when you are taking risks and what the rewards could possibly be.

10. You are most of the way to success, but you came at it obliquely. Now you have to hope that you can start a fire under your product. You need some luck, some skill, and some experience.

Best wishes and here is to hoping you can start a fire.

 

[DaveStebbins]

Also I'm sure that when you started, you did enough research to know that settings, in general, don't sell well enough to pay for themselves.

 

[Fiery James]

How to sell enough to pay for the development and make a tidy profit?

Two simple words: Get Lucky.

Pretty cynical, I know.

Search the ENWorld threads for opinions on the BattleBox, one of our hottest products in years. Check Monte Cook's Line of Sight review of GenCon and see what his Number 1 pick of the convention was. Check out our website.

BattleBox, with all of the hype following GenCon, is doing... ok. Not amazing, not awesome. Just ok.

We've got established distribution and people that have been buying our d20 and other products since November 2000. That's 4 years now. We've created over 30 skus, and been aligned with some of the biggest publishers in the rpg industry.

And here we are, 4 years later, and we're all still doing this in our off-hours, for the fun of it.

So, here's my best advice: Don't do it for the money. Don't expect to make money. Actually, expect to lose money. Then be happily surprised if you actually get some coin -- far better that than counting on some cash and being disappointed.

(I hope this doesn't impact my image as the happy-go-lucky fellow of d20. I'm not really bitter or really that cynical, in truth. Just keenly aware of the financial difficulties facing small publishers this holiday season. Now everyone go get a BattleBox. And Counter Collection: Digital. And, since I don't want to be a thread-jacker, get Acrohelion campaign setting while you're at it. )

- James

 

[Great Mastiff Games]

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