What are the intangibles that make D&D fun?

[Mallus]

I'd add: in 4e it can also be done using the skill challenge rules, provided the GM let's the players take the lead in shaping their response to the challenge, and using early successes to establish the ingame context for subsequent skill attempts. There's no reason, in principle, why a successful skill challenge couldn't even result in the death of a foe.

While I have some issues with the Skill Challenge rules, the best thing about them, which I believe are only partially-stated, is that they offer an incredibly flexible system for players to affect the game environment.

My experience is too many campaigns become 'how do we fix it with magic' by mid-to-high level. Thus strategy breaks downs to spell selection, more or less. 4e removes most spells, turns some into Rituals, and then goes even further by adding this --admittedly wonky-- tool for doing almost anything in-game.

Trying to: start a war? Open a success trade route? Make your own artifact? Kill a dragon with a folding boat? Why not use a Skill Challenge...

The specifics are still buggy, but the idea that you can produce almost any effect in/on the game is golden.

 

[Scribble]

Way back in like the mid 90s there was a crazy snow storm.

The first day it snowed, and we had off from school my friends came over (despite the crazy weather) and we decided to run a one-shot GURPS Old West game.

They made characters, and I ran the game.

Then the snow storm continued and we we had off again, so the One-Shot became a Two-Shot.

Then the snow storm became a blizzard and another snow storm hit and the two-shot became a two week long string of GURPS Old-West that I'll never forget.

I've never had as much fun playing GURPS as I did then, and yet we still talk about that mini campaign to this day.

Is GURPS Old-West is somehow a system tat promotes a more fun GURPS atmosphere? I don't believe so.

I think set and setting has a WHOLE lot to do with the intangible fun part of any system.

 

[malraux]

For me, its margaritas.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

For me there is no doubt that my life when I was younger is the main thing. Back then D&D was nothing but carefree fun. It was the top thing to look forward to each week among many things I had to look forward to.

Now when I game I have all these other aspects of my life competing for my attention. While I enjoy my games, my looking forward to them is tempered by the list of other things I know I need to or should be doing instead.

And the accumulation of knowledge over the years has lessened that sense of wonder. Back in the day, my first encounter with a Carrion Crawler was an amazing combination of confusion, terror and joy. Now an encounter with a new creature has me doing an immediate assement of its possible abilites, looking for any cues as to weaknesses etc.

Basically I have let life get in the way of living in the moment. Someday I hope to figure out how to get at lease some of that back.

 

[Dausuul]

It isn't just nostalgia.

When Gary Gygax died, my gaming group got together and we did an impromptu game night in his honor, using my BECMI rulebooks (I didn't have AD&D handy). Except for me, none of them had ever played D&D previous to 3.5. Everyone had a lot of fun and several of them said they liked it better than 3.5.

Given that I was DMing, I suppose it's possible it was because I had played in old editions, and was therefore bringing more energy to the table due to nostalgia... but I don't think so. I think there really is something to the old-school movement. Although I'm not sure how much of it is the system per se, and how much is the different social contract--much more freewheeling, more ready to let the DM call the shots instead of consulting the rulebook.

 

[Scribble]

It isn't just nostalgia.

When Gary Gygax died, my gaming group got together and we did an impromptu game night using my old BECMI rulebooks (I didn't have AD&D handy). Except for me, none of them had ever played D&D previous to 3.5. Everyone had a lot of fun and several of them said they liked it better than 3.5.

Given that I was DMing, I suppose it's possible it was because I had played in old editions, and was therefore bringing more energy to the table due to nostalgia... but I don't think so. I think there really is something to the old-school movement. Although I'm not sure how much of it is the system per se, and how much is the different social contract--much more freewheeling, more ready to let the DM call the shots instead of consulting the rulebook.

I don't really agree with the idea that games are/were only fun because of nostalgia either.

One thing I wonder about your game?

Was it really more freewheeling because the rules promoted it, or because the people playing were under the impression that the system promoted it, so were more willing to accept it?

Not saying I believe either one is true... I'm honestly curious?

 

[Doug McCrae]

And the accumulation of knowledge over the years has lessened that sense of wonder. Back in the day, my first encounter with a Carrion Crawler was an amazing combination of confusion, terror and joy. Now an encounter with a new creature has me doing an immediate assement of its possible abilites, looking for any cues as to weaknesses etc.

Basically I have let life get in the way of living in the moment. Someday I hope to figure out how to get at lease some of that back.

Innocence can never be regained. It's impossible to unknow what you know.

 

[Scribble]

Innocence can never be regained. It's impossible to unknow what you know.

I knew a guy who started spraying metallic spray paint on paper towels, lighting them on fire, and then smoking them like cigarettes.

He un-knew a WHOLE lot of what he once knew.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Innocence can never be regained. It's impossible to unknow what you know.

Never underestimate the wonderful new horizons and fresh perspective that a solid blow to the head can provide.

 

[ggroy]

Never underestimate the wonderful new horizons and fresh perspective that a solid blow to the head can provide.

Or more generally, amnesia.