D&D 3E/3.5 What are the "problem" spells in 3E?

[Victim]

I don't see what the big deal is about Blade Barrier. The spell has a number of limiting factors.

It has a full round casting time. So either the caster is vulnerable for an entire round, which isn't good, or he forfiets the oppurtunity cast a second spell when hasted.

It is reflex negates, instead of reflex half. That's like giving everyone evasion. If a cone of cold like spell would hit 4 people, and 1/2 would make their save, then it would deal about 45d6. On the other hand, Blade Barrier would deal 30d6.

Finally, the duration is more of a drawback than a benefit. In most cases, the enemy will have some way of moving out of the area, preventing extra rounds from causing damage. THe blade barrier also lasts long enough to prevent access through that area for about 2 hours minimum. Given the importance of buffing spells, especially defensive ones like death ward or pro elements that last 10 min/level, casting the spell on a critical area can cause a large delay in the group's attack. Finally, once the blade barrier becomes a battlefield feature, anyone can use it. People can be pushed into it, etc. Monsters are generally better at grapple and bullrush attacks, so they gain a bit of an advantage. Read Wulf's Story Hour to see some of the problems that come from Blade Barrier.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Geas/quest isn't Dominate; you always have a choice. If you refuse to obey the command placed upon you, then you suffer penalties.

It's a great punishment tool in the hands of a lawful good mage, who refuses to steal someone's free will with a Dominate spell.

"You there, rebuild the orphanage you burnt down last night."

Evil guys fails save. "I don't think so... urk!" His stats drop.

 

[James McMurray]

Geas/quest isn't Dominate; you always have a choice. If you refuse to obey the command placed upon you, then you suffer penalties.

If you choose to houserule it. As written, it does not allow refusal.

If the subject is prevented from obeying the lesser geas for a whole day, he suffers a –2 penalty on each ability score. Each day, another –2 penalty accumulates, up to a total of –8. Abilities are not reduced below 1. The ability penalties end 1 day after the character resumes obeying the lesser geas.

Note that is says "is prevented from obeying" not "chooses not to obey". I agree that your house rule is how it should work, and that is how it works in our game, but as written, geas is horribly over-powered.

 

[Thanee]

Yeah, the description is really weird.

Lesser Geas seems to work pretty much like a command, and the creature has to obey it, but Geas actually mentions, that the penalties get applied when the creature does not attempt to obey the given command, which implies that there is indeed a choice.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Cloudgatherer]

Blade Barrier is listed because it breaks the damage cap for spells of its level. I don't really have a problem with it, it is just being listed as a spell that can break a damage cap.

Geas/Quest I think are great spells and should remain. As has been pointed out above, the wording is unclear (one says "X" the other "similar to X". The wording should be the same, or the distinction spelled out. That's why I have them listed.

Any more thoughts?

 

[Plane Sailing]

I don't see what the big deal is about Blade Barrier.

Just like to mention that if combined with solid fog, it is a real killer...

My troublesome spells (i.e. ones which I have house rules for)

Harm (for well-rehearsed reasons)
Shield (as stated you have to know facing, and since most of the rest of the rules eliminate facing, this (and tower shields) are a bit of an abberation)
Enlarge (doesn't seem to make sense with the other rules about size)
Reduce (ditto)

Others that have caused us a little difficulty:

Web (can you cast it between a table and a wall? across a doorway? across a 45 degree corner? Just how much opposition between surfaces is required anyway?)

Greater Magic Weapon (duration is so astonishingly long, why should anyone bother with actual magic weapons?)

Force Cage (pretty much a death sentence for any fighter or rogue, since they can be put in a barred cage and spelled to death, since it has no save and no spell resistance.)

Foresight (is this the wussiest 9th level spell or what? "the spell gives the character a general idea of what action the character might take to best protect him or herself ", stops you being flatfooted and gives a wonderful +2 insight bonus to AC and Reflex saves. The spell is weak on one hand, and puts so much emphasis on what the DM chooses to reveal or not, while remaining vague)


Summon Planar Ally (this 6th level spell allows a cleric to summon a friendly 16HD outsider to perform one request for a favour... so it could summon a 14HD planatar which could be asked to cast one of its clerical spells for you (and as a 17th level cleric it gets 9th level spells...)

Greater Planar Ally (much the same problems as above)

Gust of Wind (vastly overpowered for a 3rd level spell :giggles: )

Cheers

 

[Taren Seeker]

Freedom of Movement: Just what does this spell protect against? The description says that it allows you to move and act normally, EVEN when under a spell effect like Hold, etc.

The "even" indicates that mundane means are nullified.

What about a grapple? A net? Evard's Black Tentacles? Stone Hold from MoF?

*shrugs*

 

[MerakSpielman]

Commune.
yes, even with the XP cost.
Do you have any idea what kind of things players with IQs of 150+ can do with 10 yes or no questions? I rarely have a clue exactly how much they're learning until it's too late. It's a real "Reveal the secrets of the DM" spell.
I would make some questions not work if I knew what they were figuring out from the answer, but I'm usually one step behind them.
At higher levels the XP cost is insignificant.

 

[Stalker0]

If you choose to houserule it. As written, it does not allow refusal.



Note that is says "is prevented from obeying" not "chooses not to obey". I agree that your house rule is how it should work, and that is how it works in our game, but as written, geas is horribly over-powered.

I think prevented from obeying can be easily interperated to mean prevented by yourself. It makes lesser geas and geas fit together better, and makes the spell more of what I think was originally applied, as a way of punishment instead of a new domination spell.

 

[Taren Seeker]

Re: Forcecage: It costs 1500 gp just to prepare it, not even to cast it. It's a very powerful spell, but it's somewhat limited by the cost. Combine it with the amounts Wizards must already spend on scrolls and spell research/learning and it adds up.

And throw a "me too" on Commune. It can really make a DM sweat.