What Empowered value gets multiplied?

[Marshall]

I am not sure which part of my post confused you, let me know so that I can clarify it

Hmm, Didnt think I was confused.

I was agreeing with you that "d4+1" is the way you write 2-5, in the same way d6 is how you write 1-6.
CLW, otoh, is d8 + (1/cl) or 1-8 + 1/cl.
So an Empowered MM is (2-5) * 1.5
But an Empowered CLW is (1-8) * 1.5 + 1/cl.

Or, both the FAQ and the examples are correct.

 

[apsuman]

I am not sure which part of my post confused you, let me know so that I can clarify it
...
etc sorry for the confusion. I always apply the multiplication at the very end, after the total damage is calculated, this makes it easiest for me and I believe it follows what is said in the books the best. IMNSHO of course

I agree with you, and I believe that your interpretatin is RAW. I think Marshall thinks differently about how empower works.

 

[Nail]

Back on Topic:

So, Empowering a Cure Light Wounds, Mass looks pretty good!

1d8+9 (Minimum caster level 9) * 1.5 = Average 20 hp cured for 9 creatures, at range, equivalent 7th level spell.

...and it only gets better as you go up in level.

 

[apsuman]

Back on Topic:

So, Empowering a Cure Light Wounds, Mass looks pretty good!

1d8+9 (Minimum caster level 9) * 1.5 = Average 20 hp cured for 9 creatures, at range, equivalent 7th level spell.

...and it only gets better as you go up in level.

yeah, but...

you have to be level 14 to cast a level 7 spell, right?

And not to further rain on your parade, but cure serious wounds mass would cure 3d8+14 or an average of 27 for the same seventh level slot.

 

[Nail]

...aww man......

Slight Correction: To use the 7th level slot (barring a new feat from Complete Divine....) you must be at least 13th level. So, comparing the two spells:

Empowered Cure Light Wounds, Mass: 26 hp cured, average.
"regular" Cure Serious Wounds, Mass: 26 hp cured, average.

So, you're mostly right. No big deal. Ah well.

 

[Pielorinho]

Apsuman, you've gotta be level 13, not 14, to cast that. But evaluate both of them at 14th level, to be fair:

Empowered Mass cure light wounds=(1d8+14)+1.5= ~18.5* 1.5=27.25
Mass cure serious wounds=3d8+14=13.5+14=27.5

So there's an extremely slight advantage to mass cure serious, which may go away or be increased if you figure the exact average for the empowered version instead of the rule-of-thumb version.

Daniel

 

[tensen]

Seems like it still hasn't been agreed upon.

Empowered Mass cure light wounds=(1d8+14)+1.5= ~18.5* 1.5=27.25
Mass cure serious wounds=3d8+14=13.5+14=27.5

The caster level comes in after the multiplier has been added, making those numbers considerably lower.

 

[Nail]

The caster level comes in after the multiplier has been added, making those numbers considerably lower, like 7 less.

Hello Tensen! Thanks for joining us.

You'll note, as you read over the thread, that this is *exactly*, repeat: EXACTLY, what this thread is about. According to the analysis above, the caster level is added before the empower feat comes into play. Its that very analysis that is under discussion.

Put another way: after reading through this thread (and I'm sure you have, right? ) do you have any reasons for believing your assertion is true?

 

[tensen]

My justification is a WOTC customer service responce.

Not the best justification, but the only one, since the magic missile example seems to contradict it. If it involves caster level, that is not part of the variable. But if it is a specific number, then that is part of the variable.

 

[Pielorinho]

tensen, why do you make that distinction between caster-level-dependent add-ons and static add-ons? I see nothing in the rules to indicate that such a distinction exists.

WOTC Customer service is, unfortunately, not something I've trusted ever since two consecutive emails to them garnered me two contradictory answers to a question.

Daniel