D&D 5E What is balance to you, and why do you care (or don't)?

[Maxperson]

what is it in concept you don't get?

Your concept is how you envision your character. If I envision it as someone who engages in all the Rogue class abilities, even while not being a rogue like Han Solo, that's still a concept.

pact of tomb

I don't know Pact of Tomb. I figured you were talking about the Pact of Tome, which involves a book. Pact of Tome involves getting powers from your patron, not the book. The book just serves as an intermediary vessel for a few of the powers that come from your patron. That's why when you lose it, your patron just gives you another one.

it covers the same concept though even though it isn't called wizard

No it doesn't. The Wizard concept involves 1) not getting powers from a patron, unlike Pact of Tome or Tomb(if this exists), 2) the ability to add an unlimited number of new spells to your spellbook as you find them, unlike any Warlock subclass, 3) the ability to cast a hell of a lot more spells than a Warlock ever could, 4) does not involve magic being granted by a patron, unlike Warlocks, 5) being able to change your many more spells on a daily basis, unlike a Warlock.

You seem to be confusing the concept of "spellcaster" with the concept of "Wizard." They are different. The Warlock and Wizard can both fulfill the former, but not the latter.

 

[Vaalingrade]

if back in the 90's I was forced to play a 5e fighter champion or something like it well everyone else had more power more choice and more complexity there would be 1 less D&D player

We rebelled in our first game. The DM was running for just me and my friend and tried to get BOTH of us to play a fighter. We looked at the Fighter, got excited by the Whirlwind attack, found out that was never going to happen and all we would be doing would be swinging a thing every round, and ended up with a rogue and a sorcerer respectively.

 

[Lanefan]

I've never met this particular beast in the wild.

I have, in numbers; and if given my druthers would often prefer to be one myself when I'm a player: as far as possible let me just roleplay my character and keep the mechanics out of my sight.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Part of the problem is Eldritch Blast and Agonizing Blast aren't part of the class chassis.

well I never said things could not be fixed.

3.5 had eldritch blast as a class feature that did damage (almost) like rogue sneak attack so 1d6,2d6, ect (I don't know why they skipped a level so by 20 it was 9d6 instead of 10d6)

4e had hex be a class feture.

in 6e I would love for BOTH to be class features.

 

[Maxperson]

I feel like 'not zero' isn't a big ask.

Good news!! Their level of involvement is well above zero, so no changes are needed! Aren't you happy now?

 

[Maxperson]

Every time we bring up a possible 5e Warlord we get an entire Chorus of 'You got the Battlemaster' and 'What makes it different from a Fighter?', and 'It's just a Fighter subclass!' or, worse, 'You got the Purple Dragon Knight'.

And others like me saying, go for it. You should get what you want, too. We get ignored though in the fight between your side and those who for some reason are too petty to want others to get theirs. I hit that with Psionics. I want a Psion, but a lot of people are too petty to want others to have something that they don't want.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Your concept is how you envision your character. If I envision it as someone who engages in all the Rogue class abilities, even while not being a rogue like Han Solo, that's still a concept.

and done... you literally are now argueing your concept is to play a class as written and as such no other class can be that class...

that isn't a concept that is the class you want.

 

[Maxperson]

"My experience is objective fact. Your experience is opinion"

Do you hear yourself?

I didn't say my experience. Only you are talking about feelings here. I have met and played with these people. It is not subjective that they exist. You dislike simple and feel like it ruins the class. Apples and oranges bud.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

We rebelled in our first game. The DM was running for just me and my friend and tried to get BOTH of us to play a fighter. We looked at the Fighter, got excited by the Whirlwind attack, found out that was never going to happen and all we would be doing would be swinging a thing every round, and ended up with a rogue and a sorcerer respectively.

my first RPG I played a tatooed undead hunter (it wasn't D&D) then I jumped into dming 2e. By the time I PCed my first D&D character I had played a few campaigns of Rifts, champions, Vampire, Star Wars d6 and DC Superhero D6, and had run 2 full campaigns up to the teens... so I am NOT a normal starting character.
I did play a cleric as my first PC though

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

100% agree I don't want them labled 'newb' or 'sidekick' or 'training wheels' at all

I'm doing it partly tongue in cheek, but numerically powered up Tasha's sidekick classes (expert, warrior, spell-caster) are how I'd model them.