What Prestige Classes shouldn't be allowed in adventurer parties?

[Woas]

Any PrC that requires a player to be evil or do evil acts should not be allowed.

 

[ThirdWizard]

Any PrC that requires a player to be evil or do evil acts should not be allowed.

For heroic games, absolutely. Nothing worse than trying to run a heroic game and the PCs wanting to torch the villiagers who are being influenced by a Shadow Fiend, or sell the organs they found in the possessed guy's house to fiends, or possibly even.. erm... *cough* Carry on.

 

[Shemeska]

Alienist.

On a very basic level it conflicts with most any PC regardless of alignment.

I allowed an Alienist PC into my game and the situation rapidly deteriorated. It says something when the PCs (including a Guardinal and a paladin type fighter) actually considered killing him at the whim of a Baernaloth because the fiend offered them information if they'd do it. In the end they didn't need to because a plot arc later, in the grand tradition of Abdul Alhazrad, the PC was devoured alive by invisible beasts and gone from the campaign.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Forsaker and Apostle of Peace. They simply go against too much of what the party is going to want to do. Though not a PrC, I'd also include any PC with the Vow of Peace feat.

 

[LostSoul]

Any PrC that requires a player to be evil or do evil acts should not be allowed.

For heroic games, absolutely.

Don't you think that, by forcing players to choose the good or heroic path all the time, their goodness or heroism loses its meaning?

For example, Lord of the Rings:

Frodo: "Screw this, I put on the Ring! Ha ha!"

GM: "Nope, that would turn you evil. Take it off."


Although I now see the word requires up there, so with that I can agree. You should always have the choice to pick between good and evil (and the forgotten middle child, neutral).

 

[LostSoul]

Alienist.

On a very basic level it conflicts with most any PC regardless of alignment.

That's odd, since I'm playing an Alienist these days and there doesn't seem to be any problem (in terms of group cohesion).

 

[Timeron Malachi]

Forsaker and Apostle of Peace. They simply go against too much of what the party is going to want to do. Though not a PrC, I'd also include any PC with the Vow of Peace feat.

One of my favorite characters was a Monk/Paladin with the Vows of Peace, Nonviolence, and Poverty, and he was one of my favorite characters. He made a great party leader, and that included a Frenzied Berserker, I think.

I mean, the way I see it, if I'm playing a neutral good figher, and someone wants to play a neutral evil assassin, or even a lawful neutral assassin, he's making *me* subvert my character, RP-wise, for the sake of party-cohesion. Well, that's the sort of thing you talk about with your fellow-players before you start the game.

Friar Francis McGavin was sort of a random character on my part, but since the other players knew what I wanted to do from the start, and the DM had the ability to actually look past BAB and see Diplomacy and Knowledge skills as being useful, the game was fine.

 

[Drowbane]

I'm a pretty liberal DM. Generally if a player really wants to try something out, I'll allow it. However there are just certain Prestige classes that rub me the wrong way. Forsaker is a prime example of this... they just don't exist in my games. Period.

However it all boils down to Party Cohesion. I don't mind a little interparty strife, but it can get old.

Short answer: Whatever disrupts the Party.

Longer Answer: some PrCs that don't work well fall into two broad catagories: Icky and Annoying. Examples:

Icky: Alienist, Assassin, Blackguard, Ur-Priest, Pale Master. Usually, Icky PrCs are evil or transform you into something gross or otherwise scare-the-villagers horrible. These don't work in traditionally good parties, but make great villians.

Annoying: Forsaker (breaks magic items that could otherwise be used by others), Frenzied Beserker (can attack allies), Green Star Adept (requires special quests to gain class abilities). These classes require much dedication on the whole team to make the PC viable, which can drain resources, divert quests, and bore other players.

The third catagory (plain broken: see Pelor, Radiant Servant of) is never fun no matter the game.

Quoted for Truth. Although I personally don't mind the Radiant Servant... so what if they're the Uber Cleric.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

Anything with morals more restrictive than Paladin.

This includes Blackguard-as-written, everything Exalted (but there isn't a single thing I allow from that book, anyway), and a handful of others I can't recall off the top of my head.

Also, as others have pointed out, any class whose special abilities inconvenience or damage the party, and any class that requires the whole party to accompany the character on extraneous quests.

 

[Woas]

Don't you think that, by forcing players to choose the good or heroic path all the time, their goodness or heroism loses its meaning?

For example, Lord of the Rings:

Frodo: "Screw this, I put on the Ring! Ha ha!"

GM: "Nope, that would turn you evil. Take it off."


Although I now see the word requires up there, so with that I can agree. You should always have the choice to pick between good and evil (and the forgotten middle child, neutral).

No doubt about it. If a player has their character have a little evil streak now and then... be a little selfish, look the other way when 'intimidating' a prisoner, etc. that is one thing. But having a character take say, the Assassin Prestige Class and play the rest of the game as a for-hire murderer, while the rest of tha party still try and work in a neutral to good frame of mind, that doesn't fly with me.

And not just for heroic games either. At least, for me.. IMC, players are required to be neutral or good. I do not run evil games. So even in a 'normal' game, where some of the characters may have a bad streak in them, I still would not and do not allow prestige classes that require a character to have the alignment of evil (or in a few cases, some prestige classes that have 'Any Nongood' fall in this category as well).