D&D (2024) What spells should be dropped?

[Frozen_Heart]

Just here to check no one suggests removing true polymorph.

I do think it should be split though. Half becoming the permanent 'become a liche/dragon/celestial/etc' spell, and half being the 'turn enemies into a pebble or frog' spell.

 

[Mecheon]

The only things I'd recommend removing are things that are so powerful they're must-choose no matter the situation, or things that override another class entirely

So, True Polymorph is very much in my firing line for being better than what the more shapeshifting dedicated class, the Druid, can do, so that's definitely one that should be smacked with the nerf bat a few times.. Or druid shapeshifting buffed. Either or.

 

[RobJN]

I'm normally in the "gut all spellcaster's power" camp, but even I don't want to go back to casters tossing darts or pinging with crossbows!

I mean... somebody's gotta hold the torch....

 

[Nadan]

Just here to check no one suggests removing true polymorph.

I do think it should be split though. Half becoming the permanent 'become a liche/dragon/celestial/etc' spell, and half being the 'turn enemies into a pebble or frog' spell.

I don't find true-poly THAT problematic, you can change into strong creatures, but don't include lich due to beyond PC's level (CR21). And once you change, you don't have any ability you used to have, just what is writen on the state block. That this level (17+) to be honest, even cast on fighter, lose access to your ability and all the magic gears is a huge downside.
The really problematic one I found is Shapechange on wizard, due to player can keep their class ability (and all the Arcane list's might). I think the easiest "nerf" is remove it from Arcane list, so it become a druid only spell. Like "Yeah you also can turn into a dragon, but I can turn into a dragon AND still can cast spell"

 

[Frozen_Heart]

I don't find true-poly THAT problematic, you can change into strong creatures, but don't include lich due to beyond PC's level (CR21). And once you change, you don't have any ability you used to have, just what is writen on the state block. That this level (17+) to be honest, even cast on fighter, lose access to your ability and all the magic gears is a huge downside.
The really problematic one I found is Shapechange on wizard, due to player can keep their class ability (and all the Arcane list's might). I think the easiest "nerf" is remove it from Arcane list, so it become a druid only spell. Like "Yeah you also can turn into a dragon, but I can turn into a dragon AND still can cast spell"

Still wish sorcerer got true polymorph. My DM let me take it with my draconic sorcerer, and I used it in the final fight to polymorph into a black dragon (jokes on me tiamat is immune to acid damage).

It feels wrong that timmy the gnome who plays the flute can become a dragon, but a dragonborn draconic sorcerer can't.

 

[Nadan]

Still wish sorcerer got true polymorph. My DM let me take it with my draconic sorcerer, and I used it in the final fight to polymorph into a black dragon (jokes on me tiamat is immune to acid damage).

It feels wrong that timmy the gnome who plays the flute can become a dragon, but a dragonborn draconic sorcerer can't.

They have, do you forget that sorcerer can use whole Arcane list now?

 

[TheSword]

Yes. Just getting to rest like the game expects you to is a win button.

Wandering monsters and crap asperating from thin air just to screw with the players already break verisimilitude, assuming verisimilitude ever mattered to D&D. Tiny Hut is the vaccine against it.

I see.

I don’t play DM vs Players deathmatch D&D. If that’s what you’re finding, remember you can’t solve out of game problems with in game solutions.

 

[MGibster]

I don't want them to drop Charm Person, but it needs a total rework. I find it near unusable as written.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I don't want them to drop Charm Person, but it needs a total rework. I find it near unusable as written.

It worked just fine in the TSR days.

 

[Stalker0]

I think this thread is getting confused between spells that should be adjusted and spells that should be removed.

Spells that have a power problem just need adjustment.

When it comes to removal, it’s really a question of “does this ability provides a truly unique experience not already found in another spell” or “is this really an ability that should exist for this spellcaster to have”

Here’s an example: sleep vs color spray. Both are low level bulk disable spells that use a hp pool mechanic. But generally sleep is better. Now i could buff color spray…but why? Sleep fills this niche perfectly, color spray is just a goofy cousin in context. It can be removed without much issue.

Another is tensers transformation. Ignoring the bad implementation of this mechanic, do we think that the ability to turn a spell caster into a fighter is a good idea? I would argue with dnds focus on niche protection that this kind of spell just shouldn’t exist.