D&D 5E What the Weaponmaster needs in 5e, and how to make it happen.

[Hussar]

I'm not entirely convinced that we need a direct mechanical representation, rather than simply something that hits at the idea of the 4e fighter. Rather than futzing about with marking, and OA's and whatnot, try to keep it simpler might be a better way of going.

For example, if you need to make the fighter "stickier", which is something that gets to the heart of a 4e fighter, just apply an always on aura. Any target within melee reach must take the disengage action before leaving the fighter's threatened area. Something as simple as that can evoke the stickiness of a fighter. Now, you have the choice - lose your round's worth of attacks, or attack the fighter.

I'm a huge believer in KISS design. Instead of messing about with all these different sub-systems, just reduce it down to very basics. So, we have our "don't move" aura (heh, I really suck at naming). Add in some goodies for attacking things within that aura - maybe something like a Monk's Way of the Open Fist maneuver system where if you get a limited palette of actions to take whenever attacking something in your aura - push effects, debuff effects, whatever. Pick one per turn and off you go. So, the fighter becomes sticky, and anything stuck there is going to get pummeled - a regular attack(s) plus an attack with special sauce.

 

[Remathilis]

Wow, nothing like totally misrepresenting an argument no? But, hey, whatever bud. If it floats your boat, keep on keeping on.

Then again, dropping in to threadcrap in a thread and add nothing of substance seems to be perfectly acceptable, so, I can see why you might feel threatened by a strongly worded suggestion that threadcrappers get a one week holiday.

Except two posts later, where I share my suggestion on the topic. However, I can see why certain people might fear dissenting views, so I'll save you the problem by making sure you don't see further posts from me.

 

[mflayermonk]

Here is my entry. I only added one new mechanic (additional damage on an OA) but it seems like it needs some more damage. This archetype emphasizes versatility more than stickiness, but if you want to be sticky, you can get there 4 levels ahead of everyone else.

[H2]Weaponmaster Archetype[/H2]

Fighter 3 Weaponmaster Stance
At the start of combat you enter a warrior's stance and may pick one feat from the following list. For the remainder of the combat you gain the benefits of that feat.
The feats available are Crossbow Expert, Defensive Duelist, Dual Wielder, Grappler, Great Weapon Master, Mounted Combat, Polearm Master, Savage Attacker, Sentinel, Sharpshooter, Shield Master, Tavern Brawler, and Linguist.

Fighter 7 Parting Shot
If you hit an enemy with an opportunity attack, you may deal an additional die of weapon damage. You can perform this a number of times equal to your Wisdom modifier. This ability replenishes after a short rest.

Fighter 10 Adaptable Stances
You may switch stances with a standard action. You may also draw appropriate weapons (including a shield) as part of this action.

Fighter 15 Master Weapon
You gain an additional magic item attunement slot which must be used on one of any armor, shield, weapon, a Horn of Valhalla, a Rod of Lordly Might, a Rod of Rulership, or a Helm of Comprehend Languages.

Fighter 18 Master of All Stances
You may switch your stance with a bonus action.

 

[Hussar]

Here is my entry. I only added one new mechanic (additional damage on an OA) but it seems like it needs some more damage. This archetype emphasizes versatility more than stickiness, but if you want to be sticky, you can get there 4 levels ahead of everyone else.

[H2]Weaponmaster Archetype[/H2]

Fighter 3 Weaponmaster Stance
At the start of combat you enter a warrior's stance and may pick one feat from the following list. For the remainder of the combat you gain the benefits of that feat.
The feats available are Crossbow Expert, Defensive Duelist, Dual Wielder, Grappler, Great Weapon Master, Mounted Combat, Polearm Master, Savage Attacker, Sentinel, Sharpshooter, Shield Master, Tavern Brawler, and Linguist.

Fighter 7 Parting Shot
If you hit an enemy with an opportunity attack, you may deal an additional die of weapon damage. You can perform this a number of times equal to your Wisdom modifier. This ability replenishes after a short rest.

Fighter 10 Adaptable Stances
You may switch stances with a standard action. You may also draw appropriate weapons (including a shield) as part of this action.

Fighter 15 Master Weapon
You gain an additional magic item attunement slot which must be used on one of any armor, shield, weapon, a Horn of Valhalla, a Rod of Lordly Might, a Rod of Rulership, or a Helm of Comprehend Languages.

Fighter 18 Master of All Stances
You may switch your stance with a bonus action.

Oh, I like that. Nicely versatile without stepping on anyone's toes. Very nice.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Fighter 3 Weaponmaster Stance

Interesting. Is the expectation that any DM allowing the archetype would be allowing feats, or that it would 'back door' in feats?

It creates some significant but not OP-seeming versatility. Really breaking a feat usually means building around it, a bit, but being able to tap a feat based on the situation. I'd love to see an expanded maneuver system or a novel system to bring depth to the weapon master, but you've come up with a concise, straightforward design that leverages what's already in the game, that still brings some depth.

Fighter 7 Parting Shot

5e doesn't feature a lot of OAs, and they consume reaction, so I'm not sure how much a damage boost helps.

Fighter 15 Master WeaponYou gain an additional magic item attunement slot

Not in any mechanical way reminiscent of the Weaponmaster, but I like it, the way it brings in a new-to-D&D-with-5e bit.

 

[mflayermonk]

Interesting. Is the expectation that any DM allowing the archetype would be allowing feats, or that it would 'back door' in feats?

It creates some significant but not OP-seeming versatility. Really breaking a feat usually means building around it, a bit, but being able to tap a feat based on the situation. I'd love to see an expanded maneuver system or a novel system to bring depth to the weapon master, but you've come up with a concise, straightforward design that leverages what's already in the game, that still brings some depth.

5e doesn't feature a lot of OAs, and they consume reaction, so I'm not sure how much a damage boost helps.

Not in any mechanical way reminiscent of the Weaponmaster, but I like it, the way it brings in a new-to-D&D-with-5e bit.

Thank you. I tried to make something that used existing concepts in the game.

I think it works for both the feat and non-feat campaigns. Feats and 3rd level abilities seem like good analogs on a power level, so adding one feat doesn't break the power curve and I think makes a good compromise between a DM that doesn't want too many optional rules and a player that wants a certain feat. Being able to switch between such a large list of feats might be overpowered, and it might be better to have a smaller range of feats available at 3rd level and then more feats added at higher levels.

If you already have feats in the campaign, this gets the PC a feat a few levels earlier and frees up a feat for something like Alertness or just another attribute boost. If a player is taking the variant human just for the feat, they can use a demihuman + weaponmaster as another choice.

The OA damage boost might not come up, but would reward the PC for good positioning/tactical play.

 

[Bacon Bits]

Here is my entry. I only added one new mechanic (additional damage on an OA) but it seems like it needs some more damage. This archetype emphasizes versatility more than stickiness, but if you want to be sticky, you can get there 4 levels ahead of everyone else.

[H2]Weaponmaster Archetype[/H2]

Fighter 3 Weaponmaster Stance
At the start of combat you enter a warrior's stance and may pick one feat from the following list. For the remainder of the combat you gain the benefits of that feat.
The feats available are Crossbow Expert, Defensive Duelist, Dual Wielder, Grappler, Great Weapon Master, Mounted Combat, Polearm Master, Savage Attacker, Sentinel, Sharpshooter, Shield Master, Tavern Brawler, and Linguist.

I'm not buying Linguist. "When I hunker down and broaden my stance, I get smarter and can speak Dwarven, Undercommon, and Gnome. But if I go into this ballet position, then I get smarter and can speak Celestial, Elven, and Auran."?

 

[Hussar]

I'm not buying Linguist. "When I hunker down and broaden my stance, I get smarter and can speak Dwarven, Undercommon, and Gnome. But if I go into this ballet position, then I get smarter and can speak Celestial, Elven, and Auran."?

Not really any more unbelievable than, say, when I think really hard, I cause all my wounds to disappear. It's a nice way to give fighters some out of combat versatility. Why not just think of them as quasi-supernatural, the same way that, say, barbarian rage gets viewed?

 

[Bacon Bits]

Not really any more unbelievable than, say, when I think really hard, I cause all my wounds to disappear. It's a nice way to give fighters some out of combat versatility. Why not just think of them as quasi-supernatural, the same way that, say, barbarian rage gets viewed?

It's got nothing to do with the class. It's because it's using a stance. Stances are typically about combat technique and, specifically, enhancing martial skills. I'm sorry, but no amount of practice or training with a combat technique is going to grant you a supernatural knowledge of how to speak, read, and write a language for a few minutes, and absolutely nothing about the lore of a stance supports the idea. If you want your martial classes to get non-martial abilities, that's fine. Totem Barbarians gets a couple spells as a ritual, and Arcane Trickster and Eldritch Knight get Spellcasting. However, the Totem Barbarian doesn't get speak with animals as a part of his Rage ability. The Eldritch Knight doesn't get shield as a part of Second Wind. The Arcane Trickster doesn't get invisibility as a part of Thieves' Cant.

It's not broken. It's inelegant design that breaks the immersion for what a stance is supposed to represent.

Find me a stance in 3.5 or 4e that only has a non-physical, non-combat use like Linguist does.

 

[mflayermonk]

Linguist (and the Helm of Comp Languages) was a mild bit of fun. (Loosely based on the idea a fighter would have picked up a few languages fighting in mercenary companies).