Whats your opinion on the Point Buy System

[Celtavian]

Re

Celebrim,

Now, 40 or 50 pts is actually pretty good to me. That I would not mind. I would in fact consider that a happy compromise between my very high point total and 68 pts and 32 pts.

Yet, they don't include a 40 or 50 pt option in the game book. If they did, I would be quite happy since I could actually encourage a DM to choose that option. Most DM's actually think 32 points is an extraordinary character. I just can't agree with that.

Don't get me wrong here. 32 pts is "above average with one extraordinary" stat. It just isn't extraordinary in the mold of the heroes I have so often mentioned. I think D&D should have an option for the creation of such extraordinary heroes.

In fact, I often feel punished by DM's that make me play a 32 or lower point character because I like to play higher statted characters. That is my preference.

The thing most DM's don't get is that I would rather do without magic items than good starting stats. Give me the lowest magic in the whole group and good starting stats and I am happy as a clam.

I would think there must be more players like myself who feel that good stats represent a certain type of heroic archetype they enjoy playing.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Re: Re

Now, 40 or 50 pts is actually pretty good to me. That I would not mind. I would in fact consider that a happy compromise between my very high point total and 68 pts and 32 pts.

Yes, you have an inflated idea of stats. What's the chance that the few 50 point buy characters in the world meet up and adventure together?

50-point buy characters are about (statistically speaking) one in two million. How populated are the countries in the worlds you run campaigns in?

 

[Celtavian]

Re

Are you trying to tell me that you don't think adventurers are some of the best people to walk the earth?

Adventurers, especially ones that survive to high level, are probably some of the best genetic stock of any human being in any game world. Basically, you get together a group of 4 to 6 people to take on challenges that would kill entire armies of average men.

Give me a break. Adventurers are those 1 in 2,000,000 people.

Like I said, give LotR a read.

None of those hobbits had average stats. If you read Tolkien's inferences, the hobbits that set forth on the journy to destroy the ring were some of the most remarkable hobbits to ever live as defined by their characteristics and actions.

I would be willing to bet that Frodo had an extraordinarily high wisdom, con, dex and intelligence, not boosted by magic.

A 32 point buy is not in line with fantasy heroes of any ilk save the lowest possible end, heroes I cannot even name because I can think of few books filled with such low end heroes.

The only reason for a 32 point buy system to be the highest possible is because too many player's that DM's have gamed with abuse high stats and the entire DnD system. Thus, DM's go out of their way to limit the potential abuse of power in a game.

That is the reason they don't make a high point buy system. Too many people abusing the advantages of high stats. I don't like to penalized because some other player acts like an idiot with a high stat character.

I don't do it. I don't allow it. I don't feel compelled to limit my players from playing high stated characters.

And until they include an option where one can make literary heroic archetypes, I choose not to use a point buy system. Just as I chose not to use the expect method of character creation until it started to reflect what I use at home.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Elminster, Drizzt, etc were all made in 2e.

The 2e stat system was broken.

Furthermore, a stat of 13 is pretty good. A 25 point buy character (15 14 13 12 10 8) has three good stats.

 

[Bastoche]

Celatavian:

"normal" people in the monster manual has 15 point buy. 32 point buy is twice as good. More than enough.

I played characters in 3E ranging from 32 point buy to ~50 point buy. And over 32, the balance blows totally. The DM has to do trememdous work to keep a semblence of balance. He could accept any broken PrC it wouldn't matter anyway.

32 points already make you a super-hero. FR is not a good reference. And IMO, it's the worst mistake WotC has ever done. They should have made the NPC mostly 32 point buy.

IMO over 32 point buy, we're not talking about power gaming anymore.

Over 32 point buy (I have yet to try this though) the only way the system could more or less begin to make sense anew is by extending the maximum stats to 20 (24 pts) or 22 (34 pts). And still

No matter how hard and how long you'll argue about you point, you'll be in the minority here. We'll have to agree to disagree. And anyway, this is off topic.

 

[dravot]

I'm not running a game, but I've decided that if I ever do again, the players would do a 30 point buy and then roll a d6 to randomly choose a single ability to add +1 to, adding a bit of luck and diversity to the creation. That +1 might go to a primary stat or to something else.

 

[nsruf]

I love it! You can scale it if need be (give out more points). It's let's the players get what they want without being overpowered. And I don't have to hear the following two complaints:

1) Damn! He always rolls good. He's always too powerful!

2) I never roll good! My stats ALWAYS SUCK!

Amen, brother

Personally, I prefer 96 point-buy, since it speeds up character creation a lot... (28 PB is my favorite, actually)

 

[hong]

Re:

I am not a power-gamer

... you just play one on UNseboards?


Hong "can I play too?" Ooi

 

[bret]

For those GMs that get tired of the cookie-cutter point buy, there is an alternative.

Give the players a lower number of points to start with. After you've seen the players in action for a little bit, the GM spends some points improving their attributes.

If the GM had intended it to be a 28 point buy, he may tell the characters to spent 25. After the characters have spent a few sessions playing, then the GM could spent the last three points where he felt it was appropriate for that character.

For something like 32 point buy, you could go with players spending 28 leaving 4 points for the GM.

Provided the GM is fair about how he assigns the remaining points, this could work out fine. The characters most likely wouldn't be as powerful as normal 32 point buy characters, but it should allow the GM to round out their attributes fairly well.

 

[Bastoche]

If the players truly belives these points are free, throw them anywhere and they'll be happy!