When Charisma isn't the only way to measure strength of personality

[HolyGrenadeFrenzy]

No offense taken, ese.

However, the Paladin being so dependent on CHA makes more sense now. Thanks!

No offense taken at all? Good, just threw you a book. (so to speak) Hope I helped out. Tracking definitions has been a pass time of mine for many years.

(Welcome to our game BTW)

 

[Vrecknidj]

so if you had a 16 int (quite common) that'd be +3 or more to four social skills, or rather +4 or more assuming the character has a charisma penalty (which someone taking this feat likely would). And int tends to get pushed into the 20s.

basically your feat is a better version of skill focus, but at 1/4th the cost

Almost. People tend to take Skill Focus to get an already-maxed skill to be even higher. But, the character taking this feat may not already have maxed ranks in those skills. (I admit, it's possible, someone might, as has been mentioned, a very high Int rogue could really take advantage of this.)

Is it significantly better than Power Attack or Craft Wand or Spring Attack?

Dave

 

[Ilium]

Almost. People tend to take Skill Focus to get an already-maxed skill to be even higher. But, the character taking this feat may not already have maxed ranks in those skills. (I admit, it's possible, someone might, as has been mentioned, a very high Int rogue could really take advantage of this.)

Is it significantly better than Power Attack or Craft Wand or Spring Attack?

Dave

The one thing all those feats have in common is that they have a cost to use in addition to the feat itself (Attack penalty, money and iterative attacks, respectively) while this simply lets you take further advantage of something you're presumably using already (a high Int). I can see the motivation, but balance-wise I think it's a little too good.

 

[Vrecknidj]

Okay, so, let's examine what parts of the feat make it out of balance.

a) Bluff (Int or Wis)
b) Diplomacy (Int or Wis)
c) Gather Information (Int)
d) Intimidate (Wis)
e) Charisma check using an Intelligence or Wisdom check instead, but at -1

If you're playing a character with a high Intelligence, odds are quite favorable that you're playing a wizard, though you might be playing a rogue. If you're playing a wizard, it doesn't seem that, qua wizard this feat does much for you (unless, perhaps, you're a wizard using charms or illusions or something, where the ability to persuade or manipulate others might come in handy). If you're playing a rogue, then, being able to Gather Information better than others, or having the ability to make better Charisma checks doesn't seem a big deal (honestly, how often does a +3 or +4 to these break a game?). Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate, however, might get too much better, especially combined with certain other feats or abilities.

Does removing or weakening the feat by addressing those skills (Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate) weaken the feat too much to make it useful?

Maybe, indeed, the whole idea should just be shelved. There are lots of ways for a high Int or Wis character to compensate for a low Charisma.

Dave