When did Vancian Spellcasting arrive?

[Hawke]

Just curious what edition Vancian spellcasting showed up? Or was it in from the beginning? I'm interested in a little bit of history about it... I played 2nd edition a bit and 3rd but am unsure about what happened prior and what sort of spellcasting changes AD&D had.

Thanks!

 

[Zil]

Just curious what edition Vancian spellcasting showed up? Or was it in from the beginning? I'm interested in a little bit of history about it... I played 2nd edition a bit and 3rd but am unsure about what happened prior and what sort of spellcasting changes AD&D had.

Thanks!

The Vancian spell casting has been there since the beginning. I started with AD&D and it was quite prominent there and in all versions since until 4E. I never really played OD&D (and don't even have the books any longer) so I don't remember clearly the differences between AD&D and OD&D spells. Perhaps someone else who still has those original books could comment.

There have been non-vancian variants in the official rules since 2E times (Spells & Magic had some non-vancian options for instance) but the core wizard and cleric have always been Vancian in all the versions I've played (until 4E).

 

[RabidBob]

1E AD&D had Vancian spell casting; I believe all editions of D&D up until 4E did. Vancian spell casting was one of the major factors that our group moved away from D&D the moment we found other better RPG systems. It's a shame that TSR didn't learn from other gaming systems and absorb their ideas into 2E.

 

[pawsplay]

Also, keep in mind D&D spellcasting isn't truly Vancian... that distinction belongs to the The Dying Earth roleplaying game, based on the works of Jack Vance.

 

[Psion]

There was vancian spellcasting in pre-release versions of OD&D.*

After that, it's Gygaxian.

 

[Ydars]

So-called Vancian casting was always part of published D&D; I don't know about Chainmail or the unpublished versions of D&D, but it was certainly in 1E OD&D.

It isn't really Vancian (thank-god) in actual fact, but is close.

 

[Delta]

Just curious what edition Vancian spellcasting showed up? Or was it in from the beginning? I'm interested in a little bit of history about it... I played 2nd edition a bit and 3rd but am unsure about what happened prior and what sort of spellcasting changes AD&D had.

The same basic spell system (and core spells) were the kept in the game from OD&D, 1E, 2E, and 3E. In some cases the kernel of certain spell descriptions was actually copy-and-pasted through all the editions.

For many of us it's a key characteristic of what makes D&D (it was usually the largest part of any of the PHBs). 3.5 started changing lots of spells for the first time, a harbinger of the 4E complete overhaul.

 

[Clavis]

My understanding is that the "Vancian" magic system was a always a part of D&D as published, and was deliberately created to distance D&D magic-users as much as possible from real-world occultism. On account of their personal beliefs, neither Gygax nor Arneson wanted to promote or condone the occult. Hence Gygax basing his magic on Vance, and Arneson using high technology to explain magic in Blackmoor. Of course, this all makes the whole "D&D is Satanic and teaches black magic" thing rather ironic.

 

[jdrakeh]

So-called Vancian casting was always part of published D&D; I don't know about Chainmail or the unpublished versions of D&D, but it was certainly in 1E OD&D.

Oddly, Chainmail employs at-will casting. There's a list of spells that a caster may choose from however they see fit, with optional rules for spell complexity by figure type. Well, not rules, really -- just a table that you have to provide your own context for.

 

[Ed_Laprade]

Oddly, Chainmail employs at-will casting. There's a list of spells that a caster may choose from however they see fit, with optional rules for spell complexity by figure type. Well, not rules, really -- just a table that you have to provide your own context for.

Yeah, according to what I read in one of the gaming mags of the 80s Arneson had put together a point based system for D&D, but Gygax changed it to the 'Vancian' system at the last minute without clearing it with his co-writer.