When did you enjoy 3.x?

[Rex Blunder]

Stormtower, 100% agreement. 4e being good doesn't make 3e bad, and vice versa.

 

[Njall]

Your right I haven't seen them come out and specifically say 3.x sucks. I have seen them say that having played 4E they can't imagine ever going back and that they didn't like playing 3.x anymore. Now one way that can be interpreted is that while 3.x is good 4E is so much better. It can also be interpreted to read 3.x sucks.

I've owned my Cpu for quite a long time now. It's been 2 years since I upgraded it, and it's starting to feel outdated. It doesn't suck, but the day I upgrade it I won't be using it again, ever, 'cause I'll have something better to use.
A game system isn't that different from a personal computer, for some people
If you assume that the above statement means "my pc sucks" you'd be wrong, 'cause I never implied that. My pc still works quite well nowadays, but it could be better.

While they may not have come out and said 3.x sucks. That was the feeling I got at least reading all the promo stuff.

The promo stuff highlights the changes, and said changes were made for a reason.
What should they do? Take the preview articles from what they didn't change because they felt it was fine as it was?

They have also come out specifically and said certain things in 3.x were either broken or badwrongfun (yes they didn't use that exact word), several of which I didn't think were broken or badwrongfun. To me that is also negative advertising as they are promoting something by saying that either that the thing I am playing doesn't work right when I think it does or I am playing wrong.

They said that some aspects of the game weren't fun, in their opinion, or that they weren't fun enough.
This doesn't mean "the game sucks", it means "we feel that the game is/was lackluster in some areas".
And in 3.x some things were broken ( see polymorph, for example ), and they were aware of this even during the last years of 3.x ( see the PH2 for this specific matter ).

Again, since their first goal was to make the game better in these respects, what else could they say?
"We felt that 3.x is the best system out there, but we'll change things for the sake of it and hope you buy it"?
Furthermore, some of them actually helped developing said system.
They should be the ones that feel worse when someone criticizes the game...

 

[Blackeagle]

I don't get what the 3.x bashers (particularly the WotC staffers) are smoking to be honest. Was it perfect? Of course not, and neither will 4e be for that matter, but it certainly wasn't this unholy abomination of a game that WotC and the 4e fanboys seem to have turned it into over the last 6 months or so.

One thing to keep in mind here is that the folks at WotC play D&D a lot. From the descriptions I've heard, they can be at the game table (either in campaigns or playtests) several hours per day. I'm sure after all that playing time they're probably a bit more conscious about 3e's flaws than the average gamer.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

One thing to keep in mind here is that the folks at WotC play D&D a lot. From the descriptions I've heard, they can be at the game table (either in campaigns or playtests) several hours per day. I'm sure after all that playing time they're probably a bit more conscious about 3e's flaws than the average gamer.

Well, it might be worse. Some of the flaws might be their own faults. (Some of the current designer/developers were also part of the 3.0 or 3.5 design teams, if I am not mistaken)
And off course, they actually painstakingly analyzed the game for the past few years to find every flaw. And they have read the FAQs, have customer support feedback, browse the forums.

Man, if I had to go back to everything I programmed in the past 1 1/2 years, there is so much I would want to change, so much I should... But I can't. Don't have the time.

 

[TerraDave]

When did I last enjoy 3E? Saturday.

Will I ever DM it again after 4E is released? I hope not.

 

[TerraDave]

3.x started out like the hot new girlfriend every guy wants. She was sleek, sexy, smart and got all the attention. As you started to get to know her, you realized she was complicated- sometimes in good ways, but other times in negative ways- and there was a set of unspoken assumptions that she expected you to adhere to, or there'd be hell to pay later. At first, spending time with her was fun, and you both had a great time- but as time passed she got more and more demanding, finicky, and she just didn't make sense anymore. You also realize she sold herself to you claiming to be one thing, but in reality it was all a facade- she's not the sweet, hot girl next door....but a clingy, needy, high maintainence supermodel. But you're still so smitten with her sexy looks, you figure she's worth the work, and she's the newest and best thing around, right? In fact, you spend so much time convincing yourself of this, you honestly believe it- plus you've blown several grand and lots of time on this girl- giving up an investment and attachment, and moving on is a painful move. But the more time you spent with her, the less satisfied you were...and you started looking around in other places, because you knew something wasn't right.

thread

 

[Fenrous]

3 E

Okay I am an old school RPGer. From the Days of the Blue books to the release of AD&D. I have played every edition and spent a lot of my money over the 28+ years of D&D that I have enjoyed. From scenarios and rulebooks to inspire my imagination to the often brutal deaths of beloved characters.

What I most LOVED about 3E/3.5E was I got re-introduced to an old love of my life. The bits that had become to expanded upon, and old issues of just sheer size and daunting tasks of record keeping involved. 3E reminded me of the fun I had in my youth of exploring new caverns with my friends. Were there issues, yes. Was it better than 2nd or 1st edition? Depends on your viewpoint and what we are talking about. I still remember when the concept of planes was introduced in Dragon. No set of rules is ever going to be absolute 100%, it is just too big of a task to take every fantasy setting, every mythical mythos, and make a game for all of that. What I most loved about 3E is the tales that we will be telling along side older stories of the Rot Grub Minotars and the first encounters with Rust Monsters.

 

[ZetaStriker]

Hmm... well, I started playing 3.x back in '05. I had been participating in several forum rps that used everything from custom rulesets to BESM. A couple (short lived) 3.0 games cropped up on the forum at one point, and I hopped on board and dove into the SRD. I'd played AD&D when I was really young because a friend of mine's older brother didn't have anyone else to DM for. The fond memories brought me to a 'find a gaming group in your area' type website, and I found a DM that lived nearby.

Things started off great, and eventually I started DM for a few of my normal friends. It took off, and I ended up with a group of 3-5 people on average, running through a tweaked version of the Age of Worms campaign. I eventually 'won' when the PCs failed to try to retreat in time after Filge showed up again in place of the Mind Flayer in the Doppleganger-centric adventure in the Free City. It wasn't a tpk, but it was bad enough that no one, myself included, was happy with the results(although it didn't help their perceptions when I did a 'TPK Dance' earlier on in that session when a newbie to the game threw a Fireball into a crowded party, killing every PC while barely hurting any of the monsters... I allowed a do-over). 2 of 4 people died, one escaped, and the other was trapped alone underground with a pack of supernaturally enhanced zombies blocking the only exit. This, together with a few other real life events, led to our group falling apart, and some other concerns(primarily that the DM was a jerk and I didn't want to get involved in his divorce...) caused me to leave the group I was in as a player.

Technically, 3.x never stopped being fun for me. If I played in a game right now, I'd still enjoy it. But I recognize all the problems WotC and others are pointing out in the system, and they drove me crazy. 4th Edition really excites me for this reason, and I'm currently in the process of rounding up members of my old group, as well as some new players, for the campaign I'll run with this ruleset. It's tough, since the two friends that were most into it have both joined the Marines and gone off somewhere, but I should be able to get at least 3-5 people for a new game by mid June, sooner if I decide to run KotS with the pregens.

 

[theNater]

A party of 14th level characters against a horde of basic skeletons?

I can't imagine what you could have really expected to happen other than ending up with a pile of charred bone.

I expected it to be an easy but not free win for the PCs, as suggested by the CR. I didn't expect the fight to last exactly one standard action.

I'm sure other people have pointed this out, but that monster, and the uber-AC and magic missiles only features, were straight from first edition, if not earlier. It was a classic annoying monster type designed strictly to lead you into death traps.

Yeah, one of the other players realized that after we'd looked at the thing. But I feel the module should have some sort of warning if it's going to include that kind of thing.

P.S.: It's Maze, not Gate.

Thank you. Edited in the original post.

Yeah, in 3.x, DMing high level PCs is rough if you aren't used to it. Traps need to be more complex and often designed differently, or integrated as part of the encounter with creatures, and creature encounters can be difficult to have turn out the way you expect - I remember numerous high-level (EL 21+) encounters ending prior to any creature getting an action. One of the problems is that CRs aren't very accurate overall, and the discrepancies show up more and more at higher levels.

This is exactly the problem I was up against, and looks to be one of the major improvements in 4th edition. Which is why I'm looking forward to it so much.

Thanks to all of you for your comments.

 

[Fifth Element]

Your right I haven't seen them come out and specifically say 3.x sucks. I have seen them say that having played 4E they can't imagine ever going back and that they didn't like playing 3.x anymore. Now one way that can be interpreted is that while 3.x is good 4E is so much better. It can also be interpreted to read 3.x sucks.

This always gets me. Yes, it's possible to interpret it that way, I suppose. But why do so many people assume the worst with this sort of thing? It seems that's what they want the 4E designers to be saying, so that's what they hear.