D&D 4E Where was 4e headed before it was canned?

[Imaro]

Of course, the Guidance cantrip which is basically the equivalent of a steroid might debunk the whole argument.

When you make a broad black and white assertion... yeah it only takes one counter example to debunk it.

 

[Parmandur]

Of course, the Guidance cantrip which is basically the equivalent of a steroid might debunk the whole argument.

Anybody can use the Help action, as well, which is on average slightly better than 1d4.

 

[Eric V]

Anybody can use the Help action, as well, which is on average slightly better than 1d4.

For sure. I am having a very hard time believing, though, that the Help action would allow DMs to overcome their (somewhat understandable, given the system) "Only magic can do that" barrier.

 

[Imaro]

For sure. I am having a very hard time believing, though, that the Help action would allow DMs to overcome their (somewhat understandable, given the system) "Only magic can do that" barrier.

IME the DM's concept of his campaign world shapes this more than the spells in the players handbook.

 

[Parmandur]

For sure. I am having a very hard time believing, though, that the Help action would allow DMs to overcome their (somewhat understandable, given the system) "Only magic can do that" barrier.

Maybe not, but the DMG guidelines about genre will if the DM is open.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Parmandur]

Again, I think people are just talking past each other.

If the table wants (say) a wuxia-type game, there is a section in the DMG about running it.

If they don't, they can tailor it to a more gritty, GoT-type game.

There is a lot of play in the joints and the base system, and I think people bend it to the what they want. Also? Why doesn't anyone ever refer to the DMG?

It even talks about doing Heroes of Myth style gaming, with the players being Hercules & such.

 

[Eric V]

Maybe not, but the DMG guidelines about genre will if the DM is open.

Do you believe it's possible to have disagreements about difficulty even within an agreed-upon genre? Assuming all parties have the same understanding of what "sword-and-sorcery" means, for example.

For a system that doesn't use a "fail forward" as a default, some detailed examples of what each category of difficulty means would have been extremely helpful, as well as some examples of modifiers/benefits for stunts so that groups avoid the "math traps" that Hussar pointed out.

It's not an insurmountable problem by any means, and sure, a lot of tables just don't give a damn, but for those that do, it would have been useful. I don't think it should be problematic to point that out...

 

[Parmandur]

Do you believe it's possible to have disagreements about difficulty even within an agreed-upon genre? Assuming all parties have the same understanding of what "sword-and-sorcery" means, for example.

For a system that doesn't use a "fail forward" as a default, some detailed examples of what each category of difficulty means would have been extremely helpful, as well as some examples of modifiers/benefits for stunts so that groups avoid the "math traps" that Hussar pointed out.

It's not an insurmountable problem by any means, and sure, a lot of tables just don't give a damn, but for those that do, it would have been useful. I don't think it should be problematic to point that out...

The framework is all there. Certainly some expansion of the advise would be nice: maybe in the next Xanathar's style book, maybe in a setting book (since they are touting "setting books" now as "genre expansion books").

 

[Eric V]

It even talks about doing Heroes of Myth style gaming, with the players being Hercules & such.

It does. It gives thematic ideas, flavour ideas (THE Minotaur, etc.). It doesn't give anything about how to mechanically alter the game to fulfill these themes. That would have been a very useful module in what was supposed to be a very modular game.