D&D 5E Why do Monks only have d8 HP instead of d10 HP?

[BrokenTwin]

Yeah, the monk as a martial controller is much more in line with modern depictions. Especially with the influx of anime and other asian media influencing the public perception.

 

[ECMO3]

There are 2 problems with making it a Rogue subclass.

1. Then you can't multiclass it with Rogue.

2. Rogues don't get a subclass until 3rd level, so if you play a teir 1 campaign you can't play a monk for most of the campaign.

I think sorcerer would make a better chassis for a Monk subclass because you can get it at first level. Here is a proposal.
1st level: Proficiency in monk weapons, 1d4 martial arts attack (does not scale with level)

When not wearing armor - can use dex for Monk weapons and martial arts, BA martial arts attack after a weapon, cantrip or martial arts attack and +10 movement.

When not wearing armor or carrying a shield - bonus to AC equal to Sorcerer level or Wisdom bonus whichever is lower (minimum +1, stacks with mage armor).

6th level: flurry of blows (uses a sorcery point), extra attack, unarmed fighting style

14th level: stunning strike, uses a sorcery point, change from con save to wisdom save, DC 8+wisdom+proficiency

18th level: quivering palm, same as currently written, uses sorcery points

Then give the specific subclass spells to replace other monk abilities, including: Zephyr strike, hunters mark, blur, shadow blade, haste, intellect fortress, greater invisibility, stoneskin, banishing smite, holy weapon, tensers transform, wind walk, ehterealness, regenerate, mind blank, telepathy, invulnerability, time stop.

Doing this I think you could make a pretty awesome melee character. Having spells based on Charisma, monk abilities based on Wisdom and Dex required for attacks will keep this from being OP. This means you will either run a 12-14 charisma sorcerer who needs to lean into melee because saves and cantrip attacks are not great or a 12-14 Wisdom Monk that needs to rely mostly on spells because AC is not very good. For a single class character you could actually dump charisma to 8 and go all out melee with a good constitution as well while getting only defensive spells (false life, shield, AE, blink, mirror image ......).

Finally in a separate topic - as far as the current class, my only real beef is polearms. Monks should definitely get glaives and arguably get halberds as monk weapons. As it is now, these are even excluded from the Kensai and from dedicated weapon. My problem is primarily a thematic one as pole arms are an iconic monk weapon, although the damage bonus and the reach would make Monks slightly better strikers and such a boost would help balance the class with other martials.

 

[Slit518]

Here is a video you folks may enjoy. It is someone spending 30 days training at a Shaolin Temple.

30 Days Training as a Shaolin Monk

 

[Mind of tempest]

There are 2 problems with making it a Rogue subclass.

1. Then you can't multiclass it with Rogue.

2. Rogues don't get a subclass until 3rd level, so if you play a teir 1 campaign you can't play a monk for most of the campaign.

I think sorcerer would make a better chassis for a Monk subclass because you can get it at first level. Here is a proposal.
1st level: Proficiency in monk weapons, 1d4 martial arts attack (does not scale with level)

When not wearing armor - can use dex for Monk weapons and martial arts, BA martial arts attack after a weapon, cantrip or martial arts attack and +10 movement.

When not wearing armor or carrying a shield - bonus to AC equal to Sorcerer level or Wisdom bonus whichever is lower (minimum +1, stacks with mage armor).

6th level: flurry of blows (uses a sorcery point), extra attack, unarmed fighting style

14th level: stunning strike, uses a sorcery point, change from con save to wisdom save, DC 8+wisdom+proficiency

18th level: quivering palm, same as currently written, uses sorcery points

Then give the specific subclass spells to replace other monk abilities, including: Zephyr strike, hunters mark, blur, shadow blade, haste, intellect fortress, greater invisibility, stoneskin, banishing smite, holy weapon, tensers transform, wind walk, ehterealness, regenerate, mind blank, telepathy, invulnerability, time stop.

Doing this I think you could make a pretty awesome melee character. Having spells based on Charisma, monk abilities based on Wisdom and Dex required for attacks will keep this from being OP. This means you will either run a 12-14 charisma sorcerer who needs to lean into melee because saves and cantrip attacks are not great or a 12-14 Wisdom Monk that needs to rely mostly on spells because AC is not very good. For a single class character you could actually dump charisma to 8 and go all out melee with a good constitution as well while getting only defensive spells (false life, shield, AE, blink, mirror image ......).

Finally in a separate topic - as far as the current class, my only real beef is polearms. Monks should definitely get glaives and arguably get halberds as monk weapons. As it is now, these are even excluded from the Kensai and from dedicated weapon. My problem is primarily a thematic one as pole arms are an iconic monk weapon, although the damage bonus and the reach would make Monks slightly better strikers and such a boost would help balance the class with other martials.

monk makes no sense thematically as a sorcerer.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

monk makes no sense thematically as a sorcerer.

Mastery of the power of oneself?
Sure the monk focus the manifested power inward and the sorcerers tend to manifest it outward, but it is still the ''power from within''.

 

[Mind of tempest]

Mastery of the power of oneself?
Sure the monk focus the manifested power inward and the sorcerers tend to manifest it outward, but it is still the ''power from within''.

one is universal of all people the other is your born special big difference.

 

[BrokenTwin]

While I do see the thematic synergy between sorcerer and monk, and would enjoy a monk-style subclass for sorcerer, I don't think there's nearly enough power budget in the sorcerer's subclass framework to make the style of monk we're talking about here really work. And there's still way too heavy of a focus on being a caster. And Charisma is a thematically terrible core attribute for a monk.

 

[Mind of tempest]

While I do see the thematic synergy between sorcerer and monk, and would enjoy a monk-style subclass for sorcerer, I don't think there's nearly enough power budget in the sorcerer's subclass framework to make the style of monk we're talking about here really work. And there's still way too heavy of a focus on being a caster. And Charisma is a thematically terrible core attribute for a monk.

we would more likely have to start from scratch.

 

[ECMO3]

monk makes no sense thematically as a sorcerer.

I think it makes a lot of sense. You draw your power from the magical ki you have inside you, pulling energy from within. You have learned to channel it towards mind and body and exercise more control over it than other sorcerers.

I think this makes far more sense than Rogue, or really any other class outside of Monk itself.

Now you could select spells that move you away from the traditional monk trope, but you can just as easily select spells to keep you inside it.

 

[Mind of tempest]

I think it makes a lot of sense. You draw your power from the magical ki you have inside you, pulling energy from within. You have learned to channel it towards mind and body and exercise more control over it than other sorcerers.

I think this makes far more sense than Rogue, or really any other class outside of Monk itself.

Now you could select spells that move you away from the traditional monk trope, but you can just as easily select spells to keep you inside it.

A the class frame is all wrong.
b the sorcerer is a replica of a genetic magic caster from fiction.
c the monk gains power from training and enlightenment they are only superficially related it has more in common with psionics than anything else and even then only just.
d why make it a subclass of anything? its basic idea stands up anyway it just needs help mechanically and with filling out more subclasses.