As someone who served in the army between studies, I can tell you that taking a break to do something else will give you a penalty to study speed.
Why EXP penalty for Multiclassing anyway?
- Thread starter RUMBLETiGER
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As someone who served in the army between studies, I can tell you that taking a break to do something else will give you a penalty to study speed.
RUMBLETiGER
Adventurer
I agree with you. At level 3, a Fighter/Barbarian/Warblade is stronger than a straight Fighter, or straight Barbarian. At level 10 as a Fighter 8/Barbarian1/Warblade1, not so much.
BUT, as a Level 3 Fighter/Barbarian/Warblade, The EXP penalty rules don't even kick in yet because they're all ballanced within 1 level of each other! The very thing the rule is supposed to do, doesn't happen in the early levels.
The character needs to hit Fighter 3/Barbarian1/Warblade1 as a level 5 character before the penalty occurs, and then he's still only rocking level 1 manuvers, raging once per day for a few rounds and so on while a pure Barbarian is raging better, a pure Warblade is using level 3 manuvers and a pure Fighter has 2 more feats. The character trades variety of lower level abilities for power and it still seems balanced, in my oppinion.
RUMBLETiGER
Adventurer
lol, I hear you. Double Majoring was a bit of work in my own experience.As someone who served in the army between studies, I can tell you that taking a break to do something else will give you a penalty to study speed.
But in the D&D world, a Fighter5/Wizard1 wouldn't be alternating between using Fighter and Wizard skills. He wouldn't set aside his sword for a span of time to only cast spells, or race into battle without casting a spell for a month span. He'll be using Mage armor, chop with his broadsword, cast grease, block with his shield, etc. Both are practiced simultaniously, He's not taking a break from one skill to practice another.
Eldritch_Lord
Adventurer
It's 3e-exclusive, because multiclassing as we know it didn't exist in 2e. "Multiclassing" was a pseudo-gestalt limited to certain combinations for demihumans, and "dual-classing" was for humans only, required high stats, and had stiff penalties.
RUMBLETiGER
Adventurer
That's useful to know, because I can then try to limit my attempts to understand this within the system I already know. Also, it's good to know this isn't just something outdated that got carried over from a previous edition.
billd91
Not your screen monkey (he/him) 🇺🇦🇵🇸🏳️⚧️
Don't think of it as double-majoring. In most of those circumstances, you're progressing in those majors concurrently. Think of it as trying to remain effective as a computer programmer, though you haven't taken a course covering the new tech for a few semesters, while pursuing your biochemistry degree. The penalties only come into force if there's an imbalance in your classes, not if they progress together, with the PC (student) staying current in both classes (majors).
From a game design standpoint one of the major purposes it serves is to discourage the single-dip into a class for the initial benefits (improved unarmed strike and stunning fist, fast movement and rage, all martial weapons plus a combat feat, huge spell list for using wands, plus notable saving throw bonuses for all classes). And then favored class provides a free pass on that for certain cultural combinations. I like the way that works and think it was a worthy attempt.
The trouble was it was a penalty and if there's anything I've learned about gamers today, they don't abide penalties unless it's from their own dumped Charisma. So, as a mechanic, it was doomed to be house-ruled away.
From a game design standpoint one of the major purposes it serves is to discourage the single-dip into a class for the initial benefits (improved unarmed strike and stunning fist, fast movement and rage, all martial weapons plus a combat feat, huge spell list for using wands, plus notable saving throw bonuses for all classes). And then favored class provides a free pass on that for certain cultural combinations. I like the way that works and think it was a worthy attempt.
The trouble was it was a penalty and if there's anything I've learned about gamers today, they don't abide penalties unless it's from their own dumped Charisma. So, as a mechanic, it was doomed to be house-ruled away.
kitcik
Adventurer
I guess I feel exactly as you expected - I disagree.
Are you saying that WIzard 5 / Druid 5 is more powerful than Wizard 10? I think that's a tough sell - and I intentionally took probably the "best" class as the second class.
That is only because the Fighter class is terrible beyond a 1 level dip. And Warblade > Barbarian. If you compare that character to a straight Warblade, you probably would have been better off staying pure (I know you kind of got to this in the second portion of your post, but I thought I would reiterate more strongly).
Bottom line: some dips can really help certain builds, but multi-classing (excluding PrCs of course) in general is not overpowered by any stretch and, therefore, IMHO should not incur an XP penalty.
That's off topic, since you won't get XP penalty when the levels are balanced.
kitcik
Adventurer
Are you saying that Wizard 8 / Druid 2 is more powerful than Wizard 10?
Your post was off topic.
No, I'm saying it doesn't matter. The rule isn't there to balance things.
(Though e.g. Fighter 8 / Almostanything 2 is more powerful than Fighter 10.)
I suppose it was.
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