Why I Dislike the term Railroading

[Doug McCrae]

That is not changed by intentional and obstinate insistence on absurdities on the part of people bent on employing the "argument from weariness of argument" to run down everyone whose views do not toe their "players ought to be passengers" line.

Calm down. No one's trying to steal your sandbox.

 

[Scribble]

And yet, here we have people insisting that it's just wrong to use the term, because Joe S. happens to adore this or that thing and consider 'railroading' proper only when applied to things he personally dislikes.

Why can't Joe get over the fact that not everyone shares his taste?

Who's Joe? (And I think you might want to point that question inward? To some, it feels like you're stretching the term "Railroad" to constitute anything you dislike...)

The fact is, most of us who actually have use for the term get use out of it.

Sure- I'll agree with that. I don't think I said the term wasn't useful?

Just like saying "It's cold out" doesn't suddenly become no longer useful because I don't agree with the average SF inhabitants spectrum of coldness...

I think railroady might be just like that though- you have to have an idea of what the person feels constitutes "railroady" before you can decide if you agree or not.

That is not changed by intentional and obstinate insistence on absurdities on the part of people bent on employing the "argument from weariness of argument" to run down everyone whose views do not toe their "players ought to be passengers" line.

I think you're inventing an argument (or motivation at the very least) in this thread that's not actually there?

It's a descriptive term. Descriptive terms I think have a way of being kind of subjective?

You disagree?

 

[Obryn]

Right. Now it's not bad gaming to a lot of folks.

What has changed, though, is not the nature of the phenomenon.

What has changed is the fashion in "good gaming".

No. Railroading under the original definition is still bad gaming. Railroading under your expansion of the term encompasses both good and bad gaming.

-O

 

[Ariosto]

We could just go by the majority interpretation, which is that if a player doesn't feel railroaded then they aren't. This has, I believe, been demonstrated by past polls on ENWorld.

Sure, that's fine -- if y'all will just publish an ENWorldese lexicon.

It's a bit of a drag having to learn that an 'adventure' is now basically opposed to what an adventure used to be in D&D, and the myriad other conventions. It's a really big drag that 'sandbox', contrived as a politically correct way to refer to what 'campaign' formerly meant, has been lynched and strangled into uselessness.

Come on, guys. Either give a term you will accept, or let it be. Trying to silence discourse you don't like by stealing the language is dirty pool.

The really fraught disagreement is from and among people whose interest clearly is in keeping up the arguments over words. They can be disagreeable from here to eternity with scarcely any effort.

Meanwhile, those of us trying to accommodate them just get railroaded into weariness and disgust.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Well, for starters, "linear adventure" doesn't carry the same negative connotation that "railroad" does. -O

This is what we call "spin" round these parts.

Your funds were not stolen sir, they we re-appropriated.

 

[Scribble]

Sure, that's fine -- if y'all will just publish an ENWorldese lexicon.

I think if somehow the game world would publish some type of dictionary that everyone accepted was the source of game related definitions it would be great. Doubt that would ever happen though.

It's a bit of a drag having to learn that an 'adventure' is now basically opposed to what an adventure used to be in D&D, and the myriad other conventions. It's a really big drag that 'sandbox', contrived as a politically correct way to refer to what 'campaign' formerly meant, has been lynched and strangled into uselessness.

What if what you thought of as "not an adventure" was simply what someone else thought of as an adventure back then too?

Where are YOU getting this official definition from that gives you the right to claim others are subverting the true meaning?

Come on, guys. Either give a term you will accept, or let it be. Trying to silence discourse you don't like by stealing the language is dirty pool.

Others I think can claim this of you?

The really fraught disagreement is from and among people whose interest clearly is in keeping up the arguments over words. They can be disagreeable from here to eternity with scarcely any effort.

Meanwhile, those of us trying to accommodate them just get railroaded into weariness and disgust.

Where is this happening?

I see people disagreeing with your definition, and then you claiming they are somehow trying to diminish games you enjoy... I am confused.

 

[Ariosto]

I think you're using a novel and idiosyncratic definition of "railroading" and are therefore creating this confusion, yourself.

The GM makes sure that the players arbitrarily are deprived of a freedom to depart from a set sequence of moves/events/encounters/scenes/whatever.

You think that's "novel and idiosyncratic".

Maybe it is in the special context of ENWorld today.

 

[evileeyore]

Are you saying a railroad is not necessarily a bad thing then?

Correct. Railroading is a tool.

From the evidence of this thread, there are clearly multiple definitions of railroad in common use.

And all of them (except the ones that agree with me) are wrong.

 

[Ariosto]

For another, the players' agency over their characters isn't denied in a linear adventure - their reactions to it aren't scripted ahead of time, and they aren't necessarily restricted from finding inventive ways to solve the linear adventure's problems.

Then it is ... get ready ... not a railroad.

It's a bit obscure just how it's 'linear', for that matter.

Anyway, "just say 'carob' when you mean 'cocoa' " misses the point by a mile.

 

[Ariosto]

Problem is, we're back to saying "linear scenario" and "railroading" are exactly the same thing. Which they are not.

If they are not the same thing, then substitution of terms is to say what one does not mean. Someone who dislikes 'railroads' must instead profess a distaste for things that are not 'railroads' at all after all.

I do not see how this is an improvement, except in the eyes of those who delight in discord.

Just get someone once to fall for that, and Bingo! -- You can use it again and again to 'prove' that he believes something he has in fact never knowingly professed.

Please, though, explain what a "linear scenario" is. How is it different from a 'railroad'?