Why is Palladium so ant-d20?

[Desdichado]

You mean, aside from releasing something on the order of a dozen d20 books and piles of supplements to support their Scarred Lands setting?

Even though you quoted it, you apparently didn't read the phrase "main lines." Sword & Sorcery Studio was a sideline for White Wolf, the main thing has always been, and always will be, World of Darkness.

 

[Turjan]

3) Had Palladium been #3 in a long time? I'd wager that GURPS has long since passed them by, and will only continue to do so as Palladium becomes more and more marginalized based on Siembieda's "business acumen."

This statement was based on Ken Hite's old State of the Industry article from last year, where he (or better, the participating RPG and comic shop owners) put Palladium on slot #3 with 7% of all RPG sales. I'm aware of the fact that the numbers (i) possess a very large error margin (and have systematic errors) and (ii) may have changed during last year. Nevertheless, Palladium seems to be one of the major players in the RPG pool. As I said, the main outlets seem to be comic stores rather than book shops.

Sword & Sorcery Studio was a sideline for White Wolf, the main thing has always been, and always will be, World of Darkness.

That was exactly what I meant. All Sword & Sorcery releases were completely new and d20 only. WW did not offer any conversions of their previously existing lines to d20.

 

[KaosDevice]

I played in a couple month long GURPS Rifts conversion. It was actually pretty fun. The Mecha rules converted nicely, admittedly though because of the nature of the GURPS rules it was a little bit mellower (i.e. twinked) of a game then a straight up Palladium system game. I'd do it again if I had the opportunity, it is a fun if ubergoobery setting.

 

[zenld]

i think palladium fans are no more "anti-d20" than d20 fans are "anti-palladium".

everyone has an opinion. this thread for example.

i play/gm d20 games.
i play/gm rifts.
i have played/gm'ed many other games.

the success of the game is not based on the rules. it is based on the gm and players.

if you dont like it, dont play it. if you do like it, play it.

other than that, who cares?

just a thought.

zen

 

[Desdichado]

This statement was based on Ken Hite's old State of the Industry article from last year, where he (or better, the participating RPG and comic shop owners) put Palladium on slot #3 with 7% of all RPG sales. I'm aware of the fact that the numbers (i) possess a very large error margin (and have systematic errors) and (ii) may have changed during last year. Nevertheless, Palladium seems to be one of the major players in the RPG pool. As I said, the main outlets seem to be comic stores rather than book shops.

Keep in mind, though, that at the time of that writing, everybody knew that a new GURPS main book was imminent, which means that sales would have been down, and are probably back up again since the release. Also, the article mentions Palladium regaining it's #3 spot after having slipped.

Although, as rough as that data is, it's better than mine. I see more GURPS books than Palladium books on the shelves, and I know plenty of GURPS players and no Palladium players, so my evidence is purely anecdotal.

I still believe that Palladium will continue to decline, though. As I said, Siembieda's business acumen seems to be particularly lacking.

 

[frankthedm]

One thing that appeals to some Palladium/Rifts/etc. GMs is this: there are so many conflicting rules across various systems that you have to pick and choose which of those rules you're going to use. Some GMs like this flexibility.

3.5 e has developed this feature as well

As a player, I think the thing I liked most about Rifts was that the setting had a ton of flavor. You name the genre, if you looked around long enough in the Multiverse, you'd find it. I mean, really, in how many other systems can you play an anthropomorphic mutant cougar psychic from the Outback who meets up with a techno-wizard Asgardian dwarf and a young amnesiac demigod and then goes dino-hunting in what's left of Florida, vampire-hunting in the desert Southwest, and finally off to do Shadowrun-like missions in a planet-sized city? (And no, I didn't just make that up.

I don’t think the worst fan fiction writers on the planet could make that up.

Give me Chaosium's BRP anyday, infinitly flexible and feared by munchkins the world over.

 

[Greatwyrm]

I'm not sure why Mr. S doesn't like d20 so much, but really, what's the difference? He's got a line of games that sell well (at least well enough to make him happy) already. I could certainly understand thinking it ain't broke and not fixing it.

 

[Sir Elton]

I don't like Rifts so much as K.S.' attitude towards his own customer base. Stating quite simply, he doesn't like people creating derivative works. So, what is every Palladium Campaign or d20 Campaign? Nothing more than a derivative work.

His letter on Conversions states his intentions. However, he can change his mind and go after everyone on the Internet who posts a palladium website. He just doesn't want to share with the other children.

Producing d20 books or even stamping the OGL on his products would be an incredibly smart move for him, though. It would also show that he, sincerely, wants to share with his customer base and the other children. He hates the idea of the OGL, though. I don't really think it's the d20 system, it's the OGL.

 

[Storm Raven]

Even though you quoted it, you apparently didn't read the phrase "main lines." Sword & Sorcery Studio was a sideline for White Wolf, the main thing has always been, and always will be, World of Darkness.

Do you seriously think that a line that consitutes close to 200 separate products released is not a "main line"?

 

[Storm Raven]

I don't like Rifts so much as K.S.' attitude towards his own customer base. Stating quite simply, he doesn't like people creating derivative works. So, what is every Palladium Campaign or d20 Campaign? Nothing more than a derivative work.

His letter on Conversions states his intentions. However, he can change his mind and go after everyone on the Internet who posts a palladium website. He just doesn't want to share with the other children.

Someone gave him bad legal advice too. Copyrights don't have to be defended to remain valid (as he claims). Trademarks yes, copyrights no.