why no epic levels for dieties?????

[Charwoman Gene]

*Sigh*

DDg is HIGHLY compatible with ELH.

All class levels over ECL 20 are made into epic levels, for hitpoints, BAB, Saves and such.

THe Dieities are designed to be decent challenges up to like 50th Level according to DDg.

There is no fundamental incompatiblity.

 

[Junkheap]

its not the job of hte DM is absoulutely right. The people making fun of that statement have to get out of your little dark lonely dungeons sometimes. Most of us DO NOT have time or care to make the effort to make things up. If we did we wouldnt need the book, or anything past the core.

Everyone i play with finds it a joke that the "gods"dont have epic levels. like i mean, what is hte point?? My epic character will be more powerfull than zeus??Give me a break. They know for a fact that if you DO stat the gods, and you do fight them, the only time you will do it in 3e is above 20.

And btw wotc already reprints a crap load of stuff in most of their books, mainly feats and magical items(Don't know about elh). I don't see people complaing about why they did that. They could have used those extra pages to put in extra info. I doubt anybody her would complain if the gods books contained elh stuff. I am pretty sure there would be less complaining. If you don't want to fight any gods what does it matter if they have epic levels? But if you do, i sure as hell want to see it.

btw i am not complaining about compatibilily issues here. Its just if i am buying books that mostly CANNOT be used under core rules, USE the ELH. Either that of at least give us a download of the modifications to epic levels.

 

[Tewligan]

i see this as lack of forward planning by the management of wotc. they cared more for turning a buck then making sure the products they produced had some sort of linear design ideas.

Actually, if they cared more about turning a buck, I'd think they would make it necessary to have book A to use book B to use book C, etc. As it stands now, though, I can use Deities and Demigods without needing to buy the ELH. You, on the other hand, are free to apply your bootlegged copy of ELH to any other material you've gotten your hands on with a little bit of work. I appreciate the fact that they aren't making me buy books that don't interest me to get the full use out of a book that does.

Oh, and it's "not your job" to apply epic levels and/or items to things to suit your campaign? Perhaps you're on the wrong side of the screen.

 

[eXodus]

it is not the job of the dms....

that comment is getting me more flack then if i were to have said that gary gygax was a tired old powergamer.

to clarify.

they are PAYING people to design these books. there are supposed professionals writing and designing these books for use.

that is why i think that it should have been on the shoulders of the designers at wotc to make these books mesh together.

the optional book logic has been beaten dead.

but only a couple people have actually been able to raise up the thoughts that perhaps these books should very well have been made to work together.

why is it so bizarre for me to think that people who play epic level games will also end up using dieties in those games?

seeing as a 30th level cleric has a better chance of meeting a god then a 1st level cleric would it not make a little more sense to have the books written with the same set of rules in mind?

i thank you all for your comments.

 

[Umbran]

Re: it is not the job of the dms....

why is it so bizarre for me to think that people who play epic level games will also end up using dieties in those games?

It isn't.

However, why is it so odd to think that maybe it's a good idea to not have one book require the other? Maybe many people playing epic rules want gods. But maybe many people not playing epic rules also want them. Or maybe people who decide to use different epic rules may want them.

In terms of design, it does make sense to have them each be stand-alone. It seems better to me to create the books all on one baseline - the core rules, than to have book trees.

How much more qwould you gripe if you found you had to try to take ELH content out of your gods?

 

[eXodus]

Re: Re: it is not the job of the dms....

How much more qwould you gripe if you found you had to try to take ELH content out of your gods?

i really understand your thoughts.

but on the other hand i am willing to bet that most people who use one book will be using the other. although the friendly folks here will assure me that no one uses them both.

your ideas about book trees, why not make those books on the same tree?

 

[Nightfall]

Personally, I have my gods, and while epic levels are CERTAINLY within my pervue as a DM/GM, I don't neccessarily SEE the need to enjoin the use of epic levels with D&Dmg in terms of the following SDAs:

Alter Reality: Harm cast with Divine Spell Focus: DC 19 PLUS the abilit mods of a god with 45-60 Int. Tell me an epic level guy can do that?

Anhiliating Strike. I REALLY don't see a god, that HITS every time as a Greater Deity, is going to miss not to MENTION make it count ALOT!

Divine Storm: LOTS of Divine power (an energy format I may add I don't believe an epic level character CAN have a resistance too.) plus other energy formats.

 

[Lizard]

i see this as lack of forward planning by the management of wotc. they cared more for turning a buck then making sure the products they produced had some sort of linear design ideas.

welcome back tsr. oh, how i have missed you....

ACTUALLY, Troll, the idea guiding all of the non-Core books is that you don't need to buy more than one to get use out of them. Thus, you can use D&DG w/out the ELH, or the ELH w/out D&DG. This is the *opposite* of "money grubbing". It's trying to make sure each book is a stand-alone value, that you don't need to buy a bunch of other books in order to get your money's worth from the first one.

But, you're a troll. And an illiterate one, at that.

 

[Nightfall]

Easy Lizard. No need to get nasty. After all, we are the MORE civiliized D&D 2rd/d20 board out here. Exduos is entitled to his opinion, even if he's not entirely correct in my and yours view.

 

[Nightchilde-2]

Aw yeah!

Personally, I have my gods, and while epic levels are CERTAINLY within my pervue as a DM/GM, I don't neccessarily SEE the need to enjoin the use of epic levels with D&Dmg in terms of the following SDAs:

Amen brother! The gods don't have epic levels because...they don't need them.

Many of the salient divine abilities are combinations of three or four epic feats, as I understand it. Not to mention the nastier abilities explained by my esteemed colleague (among other nasty abilities).

Even assigning CRs to gods is insane.

I'll pit Zeus against any 100th-level character any day.

If, god forbid, my characters ever actually get powerful enough to *seriously* threaten one of the gods, then I'll worry about tacking epic levels onto them. Personally, I don't see it happening.