Why no love for Stoneskin?

[sumi]

While I generally agree that Stoneskin is a bit too expensive for what it does, especially for a Sorcerer (where giving up a spell known is an expense), I'd have to wonder about this. Unless the Sorcerer only casts Stoneskin on himself, it'd seem rather stupid to make him pay for every casting of it. If I'm the group's fighter, or, perhaps even more likely, the group's melee-oriented rogue, I'd be forking the 250 GP over for any significant fight, rather than say, "Cast Stoneskin on me - don't worry, you'll still make a bit of a profit in treasure!" That, or make it a group expense - if the Sorcerer casts one Stoneskin per encounter, then the group gets a net of 2,350 gold, or 587.5 GP/person (compared to the 2,600 and 650 above0. Just the way I prefer to handle it, but I think it really lowers the perceived cost of Stoneskin

Good idea. The party should set up a party fund. Say take 20% out of the overall takings on each adventure to buy materials, scrolls, potions or even wands that will benefit the whole party. That way Stone skin becomes a very efffective spell. Otherwise the costs for many materials for spell casters becomes too much. Would you expect the cleric to have 5k available for a raise dead for someone else in the party.

 

[Hammerhead]

I tend to see sorcerers as "superheroes" in a game, and try to put a theme on their abilities. It adds so much more game spice to the character in my opinion.

It's a great way to end up with a terrible sorcerer.

Note the spell Heart of Earth from Complete Mage; if you're a selfish SOB, it's better than Stoneskin. It gives you temporary hit points, resistance to combat maneuvers, and you can bust out the stoneskin for one tough fight (most of the spell lasts hours).

As a sorcerer, I probably wouldn't take Stoneskin, preferring Greater Invisibility or Greater Mirror Image (PHB 2).

 

[lukelightning]

Stoneskin used to make you immune to several attacks, which was generally great. Now it only takes 10 points of the damage...trouble is mages tend to be rather low on hit points so the damage that gets through—and let me tell you it will get through—can be enough to kill you. Yeah, you'll die even faster without it, but there are often better choices than spending 250gp AND a high level spell just in case you get attacked in the next hour or so.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I think it's good, though druids get it too, as a 5th level spell, which makes it seem a bit of a waste for a sorcerer. It's one you cast sparingly, before end-of-level boss fights.

And yeah, the sorcerer himself is the least likely recipient. You cast it on the melee guys.

 

[Plane Sailing]

One of the problems is that it doesn't cost 250gp to cast the spell.

It requires 250gp worth of diamond dust.

Where will the sorcerer pick up the diamond dust? Components-R-us might have it available in the big city perhaps, but how much diamond dust does he want to stock up on? What happens in extended absence from likely sources of such material?

In a worlds largest dungeon campaign that I'm in at the moment, there isn't exactly an easy way to pop out to the shops for some more, so the DM has allowed a rule that expensive material components can be replaced by an XP sacrifice (at 1xp per 5gp). 50xp turns out to be a very workable cost for it.

 

[Raspen]

Displacement anyone?

 

[TheGogmagog]

If I'm the group's fighter, or, perhaps even more likely, the group's melee-oriented rogue, I'd be forking the 250 GP over for any significant fight, rather than say, "Cast Stoneskin on me - don't worry, you'll still make a bit of a profit in treasure!"

Even if the cost is absorbed by the recipient, or the party depending on how treasure is handled, There is then another cost above the component and precious spells known for a sorcerer. This spell lasts for two or three hours, if you are buffing up before entering a building/dungeon that's fine. IF combat starts, the sorcerer needs to decide what to do with his first round or two. Does he go for the disintegrate the BBEG, Cone of cold the mooks seriously weakening them if not killing them, Haste the whole group or buff your character? Buffing your character is going to be low on his list unless it's an NPC cohort.

 

[Angerland]

I tend to agree with those folks that say its a fine spell but not for Sorcerers. As previously stated, sure the sorceror can buff others but if I am a sorceror am I going to use my precious spell levels to learn a spell I couldn't use as well for me? Most likely not. I guess I see them as being very self reliant oriented characters. Since the variety of the spells they learn over a lifetime is more limited than a wizards the choice of spells they will learn is quite different. Most bang for the buck sort of thing.

A wizard, on the other hand, with potentially limitless acces to a variety of spells could get wands or scrolls etc... and have the end users (fighters, etc...) pay for the diamond dust in town before hand.

 

[Hussar]

Honestly, as I said before, it isn't even the money thing too much. It's the fact that this isn't a spell you are going to cast on yourself and isn't going to help the front line fighter types anywhere near as much as, say, Mass Enlarge Person.

Look at the choices for 4th level spells. Which one would you want to cast a lot of? Stoneskin or Charm Monster? Stoneskin or Polymorph? Stoneskin or Greater Invisibility (Hrm, DR 10/Adamantine or DR 50%/Anything)?

There's just too many better spells at 4th level for a sorcerer.

 

[Drowbane]

As others have said and/or implied...

Stoneskin sucks for its level.

250gp adds up pretty damn quick. 3 uses of Stoneskin or 1 Wand of CLW? 8 uses of Stoneskin or that shiney +1 Ring of Deflection?





A few defensive spells that a Sorc/Wiz would be advised to take before Stoneskin (IMO)...

3rd
Blink or Displacement

4th
D - Door
Globe of Invulnerability - lesser
Invisibility, greater
Polymorph