Will 3.5e change most characters?

bret

First Post
I've read a lot of stuff on 3.5e. One thought that keeps coming into my mind is 'These rules are going to change the way I attempt to build a character."

The more I hear about them, the more I'm convinced that there will be a substantial difference between the way a particular character was built in 3e and 3.5e.

Examples:
1. Rangers and bards now get 6 skill points per level. I believe that many characters that are now being built as Rogues will switch to either ranger (sneaky/hidey scout who is alert to danger) or Bard (charming diplomat that takes over character interaction).

The ranger will make a better scout because he will now have enough skill points for all of Spot, Listen, Move Silently, Hide, and Wilderness Lore. He has the track feat. He has the best BAB. Even now, the ranger is tempting for this role. With 3.5e, it looks like it may become the best character for this role.

On top of better HD and BAB, the ranger has spells.

The bard has almost the same skill list as the Rogue. In exchange for the sneak attack, evasion, and uncanny dodge he gets the song ability and spells. The main things he can't do skill wise are traps and read lips. For many of the character concepts where people were taking the diplomacy skills, the Bard now becomes the obvious winner.

2. Multiclass spellcasters. As shown by the Mystic Theurge, PrCs are now going to be the way that you're supposed to make a multiclass spellcaster worthwhile. There are other examples, such as the Spellsword and Arcane Trickster, but those were just as much about adding style and abilities related to that style as they were about game mechanics. The Mystic Theurge is all about mechanics.

3. Changes to spells. I can't help but think that many Sorcerers are going to want to change their spells known after the new books come out, as some spells (such as Haste) change the way they work and other spells change in spell level.



Looking over the material, I can't help but feel that the changes will have unexpected consequences on all characters and the way they are built.
 

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Remathilis

Legend
I think we'll see the following changes...

1.) The rise of fighter1/bardX. Bards will want to delay some of thier abilties for full armor (no ASF) and martial weapons. Did I mention bonus feat?
2.) Lots of multi-classes spellcasters. The Theurge, Eldrich Knight (mention in Wyatt's interview) Arcane Archer, and Spellsword all made the DMG. Could Arcane Trickster be that far behind? 3.5 might make mixing caster classes fun, but at what cost?
3.) Rangers past 2nd level.
4.) Less rogue levels tacked on to other classes just for Skill Points. More thief-like rogues.
5.) Half-elves. I can dream.

Thats my take so far. C'mon August...
 

Merlion

First Post
I think thats kind of the point.
or each of those things have specfic points. the Ranger has been complained about since 3e came out. Almost everyone has hhouse ruled Bards getting 6 skill points for some time...including many of the game designers themselves. and it makes sense...should a Bard really have the same number of skill points base as a Barbarian?
You cite all mechanical reasons for why a person would use a Bard or Ranger instead of a rogue for certain character concepts. you forget the roleplaying aspects...and the fact that many of those classes abilities dont really fit those roles. Also I think it points out a new trend in the game design...they are worrying less about what is mechanicaly "better" and more about how to make each class: 1)Enjoyable at all levels and 2) fit their archtypes.
And I believe the reason that the Mystic Theurge is less flavourful and more mechanical than the Arcane Trickster or Spellsword is because to do what its supposed to do(allow you to multiclass 2 spellcasting classes without totaly shafting one or both of them) what it has to do to do that doesnt leave any room balance wise for any other abilites.
At least, thats how I see it.
 





Merlion

First Post
Angcuru said:
I still think the Rangers should lose the spells and pick up feats like a fighter, but less often.

I dont think Wizards will ever give anyone but the fighter and the wizard bonus feats of any kind.
And I think the magic makes sense to a point...plus if you take that away and make them a magicless wilderness warrior/scout your thematicaly treading on the Fighter Rogue and Barbarian to varying degrees.
 

Angcuru

First Post
well, that's how I see a ranger. I don't see a druid-type character, I see a wilderness scout type who whomps ass in combat. Well, maybe it's just me, but I always take a few levels in fighter when I play a ranger; those feats are badly needed.
 

Wormwood

Adventurer
Angcuru said:
well, that's how I see a ranger. I don't see a druid-type character, I see a wilderness scout type who whomps ass in combat. Well, maybe it's just me, but I always take a few levels in fighter when I play a ranger; those feats are badly needed.
Sounds like you've solved the problem then. Take anough fighter levels and your Ranger won't ever have to worry about spells.
 

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