Will you be purchasing PDFs from DriveThruRPG?

[BSF]

OK. Here is what I have learned about DRM PDF by doing a lot of reading and talking to people today.

/*snip*/

Richard Canning

Richard,
Thank you for taking the time to post all of this. I hadn't gotten around to digging it all out myself, but it confirms some of the "issues" I have with DRM.

One issue is the apparent limit on how many machines can use the product through it's lifespan. If it is 6, then I have a 2 year lifespan at best, if I am very careful about where I use the DRM PDF.

Another issue is the apparent handing over the keys to a third party. I don't want to be reliant on Adobe, or Microsoft, to be able to read a PDF I bought from somebody else.

These aren't the only issues I have, but these are two biggies.

 

[Dimwhit]

2. From Adobe's remarks on eBooks:

/snip[/snip]

4. My bad. When I tried to go partway through the process, I only saw Paypal. Advantage, STILL RPGNow, because RPGNow STILL minimizes the number of untrustworthy third parties required, and DTRPG does not. Just not as badly as I originally feared.
5. Registration at RPGNow took me 30 seconds. And most of that was opening my webmail browser, to click on the confirmation linkie. DTRPG took me a few minutes, and I didn't go through the Adobe registration part. I am including reading the instructions as part of that time. Neither is much time, but there is a noticeable difference. Advantage, RPGNow.
6. Yeah, and it's not like it's major, except that it's a consumer preference.

2. Yeah, I just don't get it. Either Adobe is out there, or companies can choose how they want the DRM to work for their products. I've already put them on two of my machines, and others have done more. I think Adobe's information is outdated or something. But, as others have mentioned, one of these companies needs to provide some definitive answers to this issue.

4. True. Though I guess I don't see Adobe as an untrustworthy third party. Of if they are, then I was screwed long before I registered the DRM.

5. I'll give you that. Though I admit to not being good at reading instructions. It's definitely a longer startup process with DTRPG, but as long as it's a one-time thing, I don't see it as a major ding. But you are right.

6. Agreed

 

[tauton_ikhnos]

2. Yeah, I just don't get it. Either Adobe is out there, or companies can choose how they want the DRM to work for their products. I've already put them on two of my machines, and others have done more. I think Adobe's information is outdated or something. But, as others have mentioned, one of these companies needs to provide some definitive answers to this issue.

I can accept that. I've refused to sign in, so I have to rely on their documentation, though :-(

 

[RCanning]

Update to my technical query sent to DTRPG.

No responce.

I can't use the product as advertised. I sent them an query about it and have waited 24 hours. I have not heard anything in that time; a far cry from the 20 mins that has been stated as the example of how good their service is.

OK, I can understand that they are swamped at the moment, so lets see what they come up with.

Also, I am going to make some notes of the things I have learned by studying up on DRM, and it's limitations, and how Adobe sell the product for us (for internal company document control, not for worldwide distribution of for sale products); when I have this done I will send them a letter of concern, and see if they even bother to respond. When I do this I will post the letter here on ENWorld, as well as any responces I get.

Richard Canning

 

[BASHMAN]

Ha!

ROTFLMAO! I cannot believe how many people took the time to vote on this just to say they would NOT buy stuff from DTRPG! I am going to email them the link to this message board. 388 nos vs. 59 yeses! 85% of people polled said they would not buy it!

Maybe then the will see how out of touch they are with potential customers!

 

[PeterDonis]

I voted no for three main reasons:

(1) The main machine I read game PDFs on (my desktop) is a Linux machine. No can do with DRM, at least until Adobe releases a 6.0 reader for Linux--but even then, if their current Linux reader is any judge, it sucks compared to the other Linux PDF readers--and compared to Adobe's Windows reader--now there's an achievement, making a program that runs better on Windows than it does on Linux...

(2) The other machine I have (my laptop) already has Acrobat 5 (full version) installed, for making PDFs. It can't coexist with the Acrobat 6 reader, and I ain't gonna shell out for the full version of Acrobat 6 just to read DRM PDFs.

(3) I don't like the whole trend that DRM represents. One of the reasons I do most of my home computer stuff on a Linux machine is that I suspect Windows itself will have something like DRM embedded in it in another version or two, to "prevent software piracy" as they will put it, at which point I'll be buying no more computers that run Windows. Granted, getting Microsoft to think twice about this business model is a lot less likely than getting DTRPG to do so, but that's their lookout.

 

[Grazzt]

(3) I don't like the whole trend that DRM represents. One of the reasons I do most of my home computer stuff on a Linux machine is that I suspect Windows itself will have something like DRM embedded in it in another version or two, to "prevent software piracy" as they will put it, at which point I'll be buying no more computers that run Windows. Granted, getting Microsoft to think twice about this business model is a lot less likely than getting DTRPG to do so, but that's their lookout.

Wouldn't be referring to the "Next Generation Secure Computing Base" (NGSCB) that MS is planning on rolling out (in "Longhorn I think) are ya? Not only will it be in Windows (or run along beside it says MS), hardware components will be redesigned to work with it too. "On the hardware side, the CPU, chipset, USB I/O and GPU hardware components will be redesigned, and a new component will be added, called the Security Support Component (SSC)." They will also be porting it to other operating systems as well.

 

[drothgery]

I didn't vote, because I think the original poster was delibrately trying to skew the results by asking people who had no itnention of buying PDFs from anyone (like me) to vote no. As such, I'm not going to comment on this particular digital rights management scheme.

However, in priniciple, I'm strongly in favor of some sort of digital rights management. It's becoming more and more clear that most people don't regard copying commercial music, software, movies, and books without paying for them as immoral (and here I'm talking about obtaining a first copy, not moving a copy you've already paid for to a secondary device that you own). Greater availability of fast internet access and cheaper storage are making it incredibly easy to share illegally obtained IP. So I'm very concerned that without workable rights management technologies, it will become difficult to make a profit selling digital works in the near future. I shouldn't have to explain why this would be bad.

 

[PJ-Mason]

Well, i sure have a headache now!

First, RCanning. That post with all the info went above and beyond the call of duty. Thank You.

Second, I have only bought a handful of pdfs since they started doing them. Mostly for stuff i didn't want to pay full price for. So i am not a huge pdf consumer, but i figured i still had a right to vote.

Third, add my resounding NO! to the list of naysayers. The fact that these rgp companies (am i correct in thinking its not just D20 companies?) are trying to force us to deal with this hassle by supplying only this pdf house with your material stinks pretty bad. Shame on you. You'll find my arm DOESN'T twist that way.

Fourth, some of these companies say that pdf piracy has gotten bad. Then some say that pdf sales don't have any real affect on thier profits. If they are that inconsequential (pdf sales that is), then why give a darn about piracy. Seems more like EGOnomics than economics to me.

Fifth, some of you Game companies say that its only for those few that can't get your print products. That sounds fine on the surface. But how has rpgnow, or the pdf services that some of you companies already were using, suddenly become so useless? Why go with this consumer unfriendly format? At the very least it certaintly isn't consumer-FRIENDLY.

Sixth, it seems like a whole bunch of you decided to do this at once so that you would have strength in numbers and the d20 consumers would have to go along with it, no matter how much they disliked it. IF that is the case (notice i said IF!)......don't bet on it. The mob CAN be pushed too far. Its not easy, but it does happen.

Seventh, has anyone created a list of the rpg companies who have gone in on this deal. I'd loved to see it if anyone has. I'll give you just one guess as to why i'd like to see it.

Cheers.

 

[JediSoth]

I haven't decided yet. I've downloaded some of the free PDFs and while it's a bit of a hassle to view them now (and displaying the PDFs on 6.0 seems a lot slower than it did on 5.0), I'm mostly concerned about the printing. People have been having trouble getting Kinkos and office supply stores to print them out. That's where I've been getting my PDFs printed and bound.

If they can make it easier for vendors to print them for customers like me, I won't have a problem with the additional copy protection.

JediSoth