Wizard specialization incentives

[Li Shenron]

So let me ask the original question with the following caveat: Using only the core books (no CA, CD, FRCS, etc.), is the specialist so obviously superior to the generalist? Every time I consider creating a specialist with the core books, I can't help noticing all the useful spells I lose - spells which don't have good alternatives in the core books. Opinions?

In 3.0 they are very much on par.

In 3.5 I have the feeling that specializing is slightly better, but probably still quite on par. I have less experience in 3.5 anyway.

 

[Psychic Warrior]

So let me ask the original question with the following caveat: Using only the core books (no CA, CD, FRCS, etc.), is the specialist so obviously superior to the generalist? Every time I consider creating a specialist with the core books, I can't help noticing all the useful spells I lose - spells which don't have good alternatives in the core books. Opinions?

Well, yes the specialist still comes out on top. The 25% increase in spells/day (at their highest level) is very powerful. Losing Vampiric Touch or Invisibility is pretty minor when you can get an extra Haste or Web, imo. You may find you can't live without some spells, however I have foudn that specialists can overcome losing access to other schools with a little bit of foresight.

 

[Roman]

So by what percentage would you recommend increasing the spell points of the sorceror over what he would usually get in order to not lose out relatively to the wizard in the spell point system?

 

[Roman]

So by what percentage would you recommend increasing the spell points of the sorceror over what he would usually get in order to not lose out relatively to the wizard in the spell point system?

Also, from the comments on this site I gather that the elven wizard substitution level essentially grants extra spells like specialization, right? What does the elven wizard lose to pay for this?

 

[Rystil Arden]

So by what percentage would you recommend increasing the spell points of the sorceror over what he would usually get in order to not lose out relatively to the wizard in the spell point system?

Also, from the comments on this site I gather that the elven wizard substitution level essentially grants extra spells like specialization, right? What does the elven wizard lose to pay for this?

The elven wizard gains one bonus spell, but only of the highest level. They lose nothing, but being a PHB elf is extraordinarily terrible for a wizard, so it just makes up for the subpar racial choice.

I don't remember exactly how many extra SP to give to a sorcerer, but I'll check Unearthed Arcana when my suitcase comes out of luggage.

 

[Corlon]

My player is a diviner/alienist.

He of course gave up Necromancy, which has made him miss out on some research/counterspell opportunities throughout my campaign, but on the whole you're really losing nothing.

"But wait," you say "getting an extra divination per day isn't anything either."

Well, he uses generally one divination of each level per day,so he uses the "extra slot" to prepare the divination, leaving open an extra slot he normally wouldn't have gotten for his crazy pumped up evocations. In all games I've played in, specialists have been much more useful than generalists.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

Basically the designers think that specialist wizards are more powerful than generalist wizards in the core rules as it stands. Make of it what you will.

Where do you get that idea? I haven't seen any posts or statements to that effect myself. If you have a link to some, however, I'd be interested to see them.

My own take on it is that the flexibility of a generalist wizard is pretty hard to beat. In order to specialize in anything, you have to give up a number of important capabilities. Giving up necromancy means losing Ray of Enfeeblement, False Life, Enervation, Finger of Death, Horrid Wilting, etc--all of which are very useful and are not easily duplicated by other schools. Giving up transmutation would mean not being able to craft any statboost items, giving up haste, rary's mnemonic enhancer, disintegrate, flesh to stone, etc. Giving up Evocation is a lot easier with Complete Arcane since its direct damage dealing abilities are only competitive with conjuration rather than the only game in town. However, you still have to give up the ability to ever use Wall of Force, the various Bigby's Hand spells (most notably, Bigby's Grasping Hand and Bigby's Crushing Fist) or Contingency. Conjuration means losing all of the nifty no SR damage spells, summonings, teleportations (pretty much the only reliable anti-grapple stuff a wizard has), and Evard's Black Tentacles. Giving up Illusion means giving up Invisibility, Greater Invisibility, Displacement, Mirror Image, etc.--most of a wizard's physical defensive magics. Giving up abjuration would mean losing Shield, Dispel Magic, Greater Dispel Magic, duelward, assay resistance, and reciprocal gyre (which is almost essential--if only to put in a ring of counterspells). Losing Enchantment means giving up Heroism, Greater Heroism, Touch of Idiocy, Feeblemind (again, if only for the ring of counterspells) and all the various charm, dominate, and geas spells.

A wizard who gives up various schools of magic gains a few extra spells but sacrifices a significant number of capabilities. At lower levels when characters don't have those capabilities and have fewer spells per day, that may seem like a good deal. However, by 12th level, the ability to use teleport or contingency is easily worth a few spell slots. At that point, the number of capabilities you would have if you weren't a specialist is starting to add up. The guy who sacrificed abjuration would be using Assay Resistance if he hadn't. The guy who sacrificed evocation would be using contingency if he hadn't. The guy who sacrificed conjuration would be using teleport, dimension door, force orb, fire orb, and vitriolic sphere if he hadn't. The guy who sacrificed transmutation would be using Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer and would have crafted a +6 headband of Intellect if he hadn't done so. At the same time, the benefits of specialization are becoming less significant. A spell point advantage like Roman demonstrates is only significant if the character is actually taxed to the point that he runs out of spells. If that doesn't happen, the advantage is less significant. (Not completely insiginificant because there are things you can do when you're not worried about running out of spell/power points (like keeping See Invis and Heroism up 24/7), but specializing reduces the number of such things that you can practically accomplish). When compared to lost capabilities like contingency and teleport, the balance is (IMO) in favor of the generalist.

 

[Roman]

I don't remember exactly how many extra SP to give to a sorcerer, but I'll check...

Thanks!

 

[Rystil Arden]

Here's the exact SP charts from UA:
Level Wizard Sorcerer
1 2 3
2 4 5
3 7 8
4 11 14
5 16 19
6 24 29
7 33 37
8 44 51
9 56 63
10 72 81
11 88 97
12 104 115
13 120 131
14 136 149
15 152 165
16 168 183
17 184 199
18 200 217
19 216 233
20 232 249

And then bonus SP are just converted by figuring out bonus spells and using the formula I gave above (2*level - 1)

Enjoy!

 

[Roman]

Thanks! Don't you feel though that the difference between the number of spellpoints that a wizard gets and that a sorceror gets is very small? Especially so at higher levels.