D&D 5E Wizard's at will damage cantrips concern

[gweinel]

I am one of those that wish to play a kind of game where the casters don't throw each round shocking graps and rays of frost in order to be competitive in combat. The problem is WotC seems to hard rule this feature, making thus the spellcasters to rely on the dmg cantrips. As I remember dmg cantrips are probably the only dmg spells that scale (if I am wrong pls correct me) emphazing how much value this kind of feature and how much they promote it indirectly. It is like to say "if you want to do decent dmg during combats you must take cantrips that deal dmg). Even the "freedom of choice" that you have to select a non dmg cantrip is a feeble one in my opinion, since it doesn't offers a solution to my concern, it just nerfs the wizard.

I don't know if they adress this feature in the current closed playtests (Cybit would help here ;P ) or in the final product, but are there any opinions on this subject? How is possible to support a low magic playstyle where you don't see every round at will (dmg) spells?

ps. I don't consider satisfying the answer to take a crossbow instead of the dmg at will spells like the 1-3rd editions. At least then the casters had more daily spells and probably these spells were more powerfull.

 

[keterys]

You can definitely get away without using damaging cantrips; at early levels, you can crossbow it up as you noted, and at higher levels you never need to rely on them since you have so many other good spells.

So, if that's a dealbreaker for you, just don't take them.

 

[jodyjohnson]

No one is going to revoke your Gamercard because you banned some spells or moved the damage cantrips to the Level 1 spell list.

5e is about options and removing, moving, or adding rules are all on the table.

 

[Klaus]

I disagree with the statement that in previous editions wizards (and before them mages and magic-users) had more daily spells. In all previous editions, the wizard started with *one* first level spell (bonus spells were very rare, when they existed at all), and if you wanted the ability to cast a certain spell twice, you had to prepare it twice.

Between freeform preparation (prepare a spell once, cast it as many times as you have slots available) and Arcane Recovery, 5e wizards begin with a decent ammount of spells.

And you're certainly not "nerfing" your wizard by not taking combat spells, you're just choosing to play a different kind of wizard. Take mage armor, minor image and prestidigitation, for instance, and have fun!

 

[Wulfgar76]

I think you might be in the minority.

While an infinite reservoir of magical Frost Darts may indeed strain the old immersion, Wizards being inept crossbow archers half of the time is strictly worse.


Also, you can always just ban at-will damage cantrips in your game. Problem solved.

 

[Wulfgar76]

Might I take this opportunity to say that D&D Next really needs this cantrip added to the available choices:

My Little Fireball
Range: 50'
Effect: choose a target within range and make a ranged spell attack against that creature. On a hit, the target takes 1d10 fire damage.

 

[Cybit]

Speaking purely from a public playtest material standpoint...

It's really hard for folks not to end up taking at least one of the damage cantrips, if not both. I think the best choice for Wizards at this point is to just increase the number of cantrips casters start with. As an odd side effect of Mage Armor, since DEX is arguably the second most important attribute for a wizard, it's not uncommon for a wizard at 1st level to be firing a crossbow almost as effectively as a fighter at 1st level.

 

[ForeverSlayer]

I think you might be in the minority.

While an infinite reservoir of magical Frost Darts may indeed strain the old immersion, Wizards being inept crossbow archers half of the time is strictly worse.


Also, you can always just ban at-will damage cantrips in your game. Problem solved.

He's not in the minority.

Any kind of "at-will" spells should be a feature of a single spellcasting class like the warlock or sorcerer. What makes a Wizard special is the idea that he must prepare his spells ahead of time and must be careful how quickly he casts them or he would run out. That is always been the challenge and trademark of the Wizard.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Speaking purely from a public playtest material standpoint...

It's really hard for folks not to end up taking at least one of the damage cantrips, if not both. I think the best choice for Wizards at this point is to just increase the number of cantrips casters start with. As an odd side effect of Mage Armor, since DEX is arguably the second most important attribute for a wizard, it's not uncommon for a wizard at 1st level to be firing a crossbow almost as effectively as a fighter at 1st level.

That's a really interesting point.

 

[GX.Sigma]

Sure, there are other cantrips, but none of them are as good (or seem as good) as ray of frost. I mean, just think about ray of frost vs. read magic. Do you want a spell you'll use multiple times in every single combat, or a spell you're going to use once every 10 sessions?

The auto-scaling seems unnecessary. By the time you get it, you can throw around multiple fireballs each day. Do you really need increased at-will damage, too?