Your take on Spell Storing weapons

[UltimaGabe]

The description of the Spell Storing weapon special ability says that the spell stored inside can be cast as a Free Action upon striking an opponent. This brings up two questions... first, if the spell normally requires an attack roll (such as Ray of Enfeeblement, Vampiric Touch, or Touch of Idiocy), is another attack roll needed if the first succeeds? For example, let's say Bob the Fighter has a +1 Spell Storing Greatsword with Inflict Serious Wounds stored inside it. Let's say he rolls a 14 (high enough to hit his opponent). Does he need to roll again to see if the spell hits, or does it use the same roll (in this case, 14)? If it uses the same attack roll, then if the weapon threatens and confirms a critical hit, does the spell as well? For example, let's say Bob in the above example rolls a natural 20, followed by a 15 (high enough to beat the target's AC). His sword definitely goes critical, but does the spell? Would the Inflict Serious Wounds spell do 6d8+10 (assuming it was cast by a 5th-level caster), or would it simply do 3d8+5?

Also, the Spell Storing description says that the spell can be cast as a Free Action upon successfully striking the target. This, I'm assuming, doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity (like a Quickened Spell). What if it's a Ray? If Bob the Fighter had Ray of Enfeeblement in his +1 Spell Storing Greatsword instead, he'd be using a Ranged Attack in his opponent's Threatened Space- true, it's a free action, but as far as I know, a Quickened Ray Spell still provokes an Attack of Opportunity for being a Ranged Attack. Would this also be the case?

I recently made my cohort's weapon Spell Storing, and I want to be sure of the implications before it comes up in game.

 

[mikebr99]

The description of the Spell Storing weapon special ability says that the spell stored inside can be cast as a Free Action upon striking an opponent.

It specifically says a "targeted" spell, so no effect: ray spells.

This brings up two questions... first, if the spell normally requires an attack roll (such as Ray of Enfeeblement, Vampiric Touch, or Touch of Idiocy), is another attack roll needed if the first succeeds?

Nope

For example, let's say Bob the Fighter has a +1 Spell Storing Greatsword with Inflict Serious Wounds stored inside it. Let's say he rolls a 14 (high enough to hit his opponent). Does he need to roll again to see if the spell hits, or does it use the same roll (in this case, 14)? If it uses the same attack roll, then if the weapon threatens and confirms a critical hit, does the spell as well? For example, let's say Bob in the above example rolls a natural 20, followed by a 15 (high enough to beat the target's AC). His sword definitely goes critical, but does the spell? Would the Inflict Serious Wounds spell do 6d8+10 (assuming it was cast by a 5th-level caster), or would it simply do 3d8+5?

That's a good question... about the stored spell also criticaling... I'm not sure rule wise, but I think I'd make the guy roll to hit with the spell in that case, but only if the spell and weapon have different threat ranges. If the spell then turns out to be a threat, then it to would be a crit. YMMV

Also, the Spell Storing description says that the spell can be cast as a Free Action upon successfully striking the target. This, I'm assuming, doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity (like a Quickened Spell). What if it's a Ray?

No AoO... and no ray spells... see above.

If Bob the Fighter had Ray of Enfeeblement in his +1 Spell Storing Greatsword instead, he'd be using a Ranged Attack in his opponent's Threatened Space- true, it's a free action, but as far as I know, a Quickened Ray Spell still provokes an Attack of Opportunity for being a Ranged Attack. Would this also be the case?

I recently made my cohort's weapon Spell Storing, and I want to be sure of the implications before it comes up in game.

No rays spells in a storing weapon.

Spell Storing:​

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A spell storing weapon allows a spellcaster to store a single targeted spell of up to 3rd level in the weapon. (The spell must have a casting time of 1 standard action.) Any time the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires. (This special ability is an exception to the general rule that casting a spell from an item takes at least as long as casting that spell normally.) Once the spell has been cast from the weapon, a spellcaster can cast any other targeted spell of up to 3rd level into it. The weapon magically imparts to the wielder the name of the spell currently stored within it. A randomly rolled spell storing weapon has a 50% chance to have a spell stored in it already. Strong evocation (plus aura of stored spell); CL 12th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, creator must be a caster of at least 12th level; Price +1 bonus.
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Mike​

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[UltimaGabe]

Well, that clears up a lot of things. I didn't realize that Rays weren't considered Targetted spells- I thought they were only trying to prohibit area of effect spells. As far as I could tell, a Ray spell had a definite target, so I saw no problem with it. Oh well.

 

[Carpe DM]

Mm. Could a spell-storing weapon cast a targeted spell on the user when it strikes a target?

(don't have my DMG at work, so can't check the language).

For example, could a Paladin cast Divine Sacrifice through a spell storing weapon?

Carpe

 

[Hypersmurf]

Mm. Could a spell-storing weapon cast a targeted spell on the user when it strikes a target?

(don't have my DMG at work, so can't check the language).

Any time the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires.

Note the SRD quote three posts up

-Hyp.

 

[rich]

It specifically says a "targeted" spell, so no effect: ray spells.

is there a definition of "targeted spell"? I agree that it doesn't seem make sense to have a ranged attack spell, but on the other hand a ranged attack seems to have a target... Are you assuming that only spells with "Target" in the spell descriptor are "targetted spells"?

That's a good question... about the stored spell also criticaling... I'm not sure rule wise, but I think I'd make the guy roll to hit with the spell in that case, but only if the spell and weapon have different threat ranges. If the spell then turns out to be a threat, then it to would be a crit. YMMV

How can a spell be affected by "critical hits"? As I understand it, critical hits do extra damage because you hit a more vulnerable area. "Inflict Serious Wounds" is just a blast of negative energy -- doesn't matter where you hit as long as you touch part of the target. I did think ray spells, etc should benefit from critical hits, but my DM disagreed. Is this addressed anywhere? Core rules would be best if someone can come up with any.

ps -- what does "YMMV" mean?

 

[UltimaGabe]

How can a spell be affected by "critical hits"? As I understand it, critical hits do extra damage because you hit a more vulnerable area. "Inflict Serious Wounds" is just a blast of negative energy -- doesn't matter where you hit as long as you touch part of the target. I did think ray spells, etc should benefit from critical hits, but my DM disagreed. Is this addressed anywhere? Core rules would be best if someone can come up with any.

I believe this is covered either in the Magic or Critical Hits section of the PHB 3.5- I don't have it handy, so I can't make sure. It's talked about in Tome and Blood, however, if you have it.

Game Mechanic-wise, spells can go critical because they act just like weapons when dealing with attack rolls. Flavor-wise, however, just touching someone with negative energy won't necessarily hurt them as much as, say, touching your hand directly to their heart. And shooting a Melf's Acid Arrow at someone and hitting their leg will do damage, but hitting them directly in the face is bound to do even more.

Basically, just because magic is magic doesn't mean it can't be used more effectively.

 

[rich]

I believe this is covered either in the Magic or Critical Hits section of the PHB 3.5- I don't have it handy, so I can't make sure. It's talked about in Tome and Blood, however, if you have it.

Game Mechanic-wise, spells can go critical because they act just like weapons when dealing with attack rolls. Flavor-wise, however, just touching someone with negative energy won't necessarily hurt them as much as, say, touching your hand directly to their heart. And shooting a Melf's Acid Arrow at someone and hitting their leg will do damage, but hitting them directly in the face is bound to do even more.

Basically, just because magic is magic doesn't mean it can't be used more effectively.

thanks for the info! I do have T&B, so I'll show it my DM next time we meet
I have a low-level wizard Evoker who likes to use ranged attack spells (good Dex)

 

[drnuncheon]

is there a definition of "targeted spell"? I agree that it doesn't seem make sense to have a ranged attack spell, but on the other hand a ranged attack seems to have a target... Are you assuming that only spells with "Target" in the spell descriptor are "targetted spells"?

Yup. PHB p175 talks about what is and isn't a targeted spell.

J

 

[Ovinomancer]

ps -- what does "YMMV" mean?

YMMV -- Your Mileage May Vary.