"You're a half elf? Really?" From the P.A. Podcasts

[MarkB]

Given that every single D&D race will include individual examples that run the gamut of a range of personalities no less broad than that of human characters, and that adventurers are, by their nature, highly exceptional individuals, there is absolutely no reason to criticise any player whose character does not match their species's racial stereotypes.

 

[malraux]

Compare Omin to Ayofell (or however you spell Wil Weaton's character's name). Can you really say that Ayofell is not a memorable elf?

I dunno, I think here you just torpedoed your own point, as Ayofell is not an elf. Eladrin are far more distant from elves than half-elves are from humans, yet you cannot distinguish between the two.

Moreover, in 4e, half-elves are not all that distinct. They are not inherently distant from both elven and human societies but adept at both. "They are charismatic, confident, and open-minded and are natural diplomats, negotiators, and leaders." "Half-elves naturally inspire loyalty in others, and they return that feeling with deep friendship and a keen sense of responsibility for those who place themselves in their care. Half-elf warlords and generals do not order their followers into danger that they would not face themselves, and they usually lead from the front, trusting their allies to follow.

Half-elves have no culture of their own and are not a numerous people. They usually bear human or elf names, sometimes using one name among elves and a different one among humans. Some are anxious about their place in the world, feeling no kinship with any race, except other half-elves, but most call themselves citizens of the world and kin to all. " PHB pg 43

How does that not describe the cleric's personality? He leads a group of loyal allies into battle, ensuring their safety. Omin does often take the lead for negotiations, which is perhaps the most defining trait of the half-elf.

 

[malraux]

So, play it up. For example, in 3e, a half-elf ages at about 1/2 the rate of a human. That's huge! The half-elf's adoptive parents will likely die of old age long before the half elf is even all that old. That, right there, should set you pretty far apart from being human.

In 4e, "Half-elves have life spans comparable to humans, but like elves they remain vigorous well into old age." And why would a half-elf have adoptive parents, rather than just parents?

 

[Rykion]

I am offended by the continued negative stereotyping of dwarves and the players who play them going on unchecked in this thread since the OP.

I think you missed the point of my post, as it was to point out that the listed stereotypes were negative. I pointed out many positive attributes that can be included in roleplaying a "stereotypical" dwarf. One of the things that I hate about the Lord of the Rings movies is how Gimli was changed into stereotypical comic relief.

 

[SSquirrel]

Well short people are funny and short people with big beards and an axe are even funnier. Seems like the logic to me

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

I think you missed the point of my post, as it was to point out that the listed stereotypes were negative. I pointed out many positive attributes that can be included in roleplaying a "stereotypical" dwarf.

I don't want to put words in your mouth (!) but it sounds like you're saying if I don't want to be called a grumpy drunk, I have to stop roleplaying wrong?

Yowch!

Another Tanis analogy, to go with the wishy-washy. Tanis Half-Elven = Charlie Brown with pointy ears.

And as for you, on behalf of round-headed kids everywhere, your blatant antimacroencephalitism has been noted. If this outrage is permitted to stand, I'll have no choice but to cry myself to sleep tonight on my huge pillow.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRmLGYSc0XQ&NR=1"]![/ame]

 

[Ferret]

And there goes another sarcasm driven china bull through the thread.

The only character I've got ready to play, doesn't want to be a dwarf. She's probably too ashamed to even speak to other dwarves. Complete outcast. No beard to stroke, no gruff voice.

I've never seen dwarves as Drunked Scottish Miners, never.

You might as well have a grumpy Elf, annoyed at having to always deal with humans/non-elves.

Or an aloof Dwarf, too concerned with clan pedigree and pride to be concerned with others.

And the fact that half-elves really don't have, as far as I'm aware, a hugely strong back ground/ fantasy stereotype. Why do any of them [player races] need to be type cast?

 

[Rykion]

I don't want to put words in your mouth (!) but it sounds like you're saying if I don't want to be called a grumpy drunk, I have to stop roleplaying wrong?

Yowch!

I didn't say anyone was roleplaying wrong. Never have, and I never will. Well, maybe if someone goes all Mazes and Monsters I might.

I was pointing out that even a grumpy drunk usually has more depth. There is usually a reason for the grumpy in a dwarf. Something like losing his clan, death of a loved one, some type of public disgrace, got drunk and woke up with an elf, etc. Of course, most dwarves tend to act a bit curmudgeonly. They have their traditions and let others know when they're doing something the wrong way. Most dwarves enjoy their ale, but that doesn't mean they're all drunks. Again most drunks are going to have a background reason for being the way they are.

When I said that grumpy drunk isn't the epitome of good dwarven roleplaying, I was reinforcing the fact that it could be used as a description for a character of any race in D&D. It isn't the definition of what makes a dwarf a dwarf.

That said, there isn't anything stopping a dwarf from simply being a grumpy drunk. I've played plenty of campaigns with no more character motivation than kill stuff and take its loot.

 

[Mercule]

I'm of the opinion that the more non-human, the better. I like me some alien characters (Thri-keen wanting to eat the fallen? Yay!)

See, this I'm all good with. That's different. Sure, you could do that as a human culture, but it's sufficiently outside the norm to make a race interesting.

The problem though is that 90% of your non-humans can be PLAYED as a human. Big dumb aggressive half-orc? Big dumb aggressive human. Heavy drinking Scottish-accented dwarf? Heavy drinking scottish-accented human. Kender klepto? Most thieves I've ran into are klepto or annoying, so it's not race dependent. So what's the difference?

Ultimately, it comes down to this: the fantasy racial stereotypes are just subcategories of Human culture/behavior. Prime example are Dwarves, who are just Scottish/Norse. But that's also been a peeve of mine - that each non-human race has ONE culture, one stereotype, while Humans have an endless variety of them.

Agreed. In my last campaign, I tried to look at elves and figure out why they might be alien. It had mixed success because I delved into it, but the player of the elven knight just wanted to stab orcs. *sigh*

 

[Umbran]

Okay, after reports from about seven different people, I will make this request on behalf of those who find it offensive:

Unless you're talking about felines, please refrain from using the P-word. Thanks, all.