Yugoloth Lore

[Shemeska]

there always the "make them more powerful than your party could possibly handle" option.

Yeppers.

Group of PCs on the 4th layer of Gehenna + member of The Demented sitting there waiting for them, wanting to 'chat' = regardless of it having stats or not behind the DM screen, no player in their right mind is going to roll for initiative unless it attacks them first. There's a sense of go right ahead and try if you want, but while I didn't plan on needing stats, there will be some if you make it bloody well necessary by jumping the gun like that. Conflict doesn't necessarily imply combat, especially at so-called epic level (which is one of the monstrous failings of the 3.x ELH).

Unique creatures when run correctly will have a virtually tangible aura of "badassitude" that will most often preclude intelligent players from straight up trying to kill them and take their stuff. And honestly, most so-called epic creatures should be unique creatures in the first place if you want to have some sense of cosmological cohesion in a campaign. Such things don't pop out of a vacuum as soon as PCs hit the correct level to make them spawn like mobs in some video game.

 

[BOZ]

if i was running a creature like that, and providing it was not too bloodthirsty, i would just let it play around with them like a cat does with mice until they decide to back off or run away.

 

[Shemeska]

if i was running a creature like that, and providing it was not too bloodthirsty, i would just let it play around with them like a cat does with mice until they decide to back off or run away.

*fiendish laughter* Yes, play around with them, exactly... muahahaha...

 

[Razz]

Well then what if you have PCs that leave, level up, and come back 20 levels later to face it? I'm sorry, but I have yet to see a logical reason why the stars of the game simply CAN'T defeat something uber-evil (or uber-good, if you're playing the bad guys). I'm not saying MY games are run like that, but my players tend to take after japanese anime and movies like FFVII: Advent Children and DBZ, Naruto, BLEACH, X, Samurai Deeper Kyo, etc. and pretty much WANT to do uber-stuff and feel uber. They are great RPers, so don't assume they're playing D&D like a video game, because they get very involved with story, background, and plot. It's just my group appeals to a more 100-ft. radius fireball slinging types as opposed to 20-ft. radius, if you get my meaning.

So, yeah, the official stats of a powerful being via Epic Level Handbook monster format goes a long way for many people's campaign. I'm sure I am not the only one that feels this way and devoting just a couple of pages to statting a creature really is not asking much at all. No ones campaign is going to go down the tubes if Asmodeus' stats are given or the stats for the abyssal layer that's living or some uber-obyrith lord.

And, yes, I am one of the few that enjoyed 3E Deities&Demigods because if Greek heroes can tackle deities why can't PCs if they ever wanted to aspire to be a "Greek-hero" type?

And, no, epic monsters do not pop like a video game. You might as well state the same thing when dragons and beholders start becoming more prominent in a campaign once the PCs suddenly hit double-digits in level. It's just the way the game works.

Of course, throwing the 1000th 15th-level kobold villain will grind your players nerves if that's how such games are run.

I don't play, I DM full-time, but if I did play I am the spiteful type---if the DM makes something unkillable, I'll find a way to do it no matter how many characters are sacrificed trying.

 

[BOZ]

if you give it 400 HD, 20 more levels won't make a lick of difference.

 

[Nightfall]

Depending on the setting, of course.

*coughFRcough*

You forgot Dragonlance too Pants.

But yeah I hate that when they wrote that series and then said "Hey look we can have a high powered Chosen of Mystra get taken by a former lord of the Nine and now have to have Mystra herself save him. And the next day a god forces an Ultraloth to serve him or accept oblivion. Yeah that makes so much sense..."

 

[BOZ]

well, with DL the novels are the *most* important thing for canon!

 

[Nightfall]

Boz,

LOL! Maybe but there are some I take umbrage with. *points at Dragons of Summer Flame and the resulting mess of the 5th age before the War of Souls*.

 

[sckeener]

Boz,

Not sure if you noticed (because I only just now found out), but someone (called Aryathanjiil ) started up some other naming wiki-s

Named Yugoloth Project

and here are the other ones that have sprung up
Named Demodand Project
Named Celestial Project
Named Devil Project

and the old classic and my fave
Named Demon Project

 

[Nightfall]

Bump for Boz and Shemmy.