Ovinomancer
No flips for you!
Double post
My design problem: rogues get to run fast while fighters don't.
Design constraints: minimum intrusion
Your solution: add concrete sub-system for using athletics to run faster. Because rogues will now run even faster because expertise (lacking in fighters), add and balance change to class progression to add limited expertise choice to all classes so they can choose to offset rogue run fast options.
Result: rogues still run faster because the original issue is untouched and all fixes also apply to rogues. Game much more complicated and further from baseline.
My solution (if I were inclined): you can't dash twice.
So thematic it never existed before, isn't nentioned in the fluff, and disappears immediately in the chase mechanics?
Sure. Meanwhile, fighters are powerful athletes that are handily outrun by scrawny rogues, who, weirdly, aren't just half again faster but also better athletes.
Yes, lack of STR is a small hinderance for athletics, but it doesn't address that fighters, who can get Remarkable Athlete, are 1/3 slower than rogues.They're only better athletes if they have expertise in athletics, and even then are probably still not better until fairly high levels due to starting with a -3 or -4 deficit in their strength score for typical builds, which expertise doesn't overcome until level 9 or 13. And even then, they're only better athletes for things that fall under the purview of the athletics skill (so, climbing, and grappling, mostly -- there's no reference to athletics for running in the rules, and even jumping depends heavily on the strength score itself). Much of what we normally refer to as athleticism IRL, particularly the things we tend to think fighters are going to be good at, just falls under straight STR or CON in the game.
And they're only half again faster in short bursts: as soon as it becomes a chase situation, they will only have the edge for the first 18 seconds or so, tops, after which the fighter (who probably has better CON, will start to catch up).
And in combat, where yes, they could theoretically double dash every round, how often do you end up wanting to double dash even twice in a row outside a chase?
This whole thread just feels like an attempt to address a nonexistent problem. Like, just let rogues have their things, man! Fighters are better at putting out and taking hurt (which weigh heavily in D&D); rogues are better at maneuvering, avoiding getting hurt, and utility.
Yes, lack of STR is a small hinderance for athletics, but it doesn't address that fighters, who can get Remarkable Athlete, are 1/3 slower than rogues.
And the bit where it drops out if you go to chase or overland movement rules just underlines it's a mechanical artifact. I dislike mechanical artifacts that result in strains of suspension of disbelief. Note its note "rogue go fast" its the all the time and no one else can go fast. Except monks, where its a resource and very thematic.
Upon reviewing the Chase rules (PHB p252), I don't see that bonus actions are specifically prohibited. A PC can cast a spell or attack during a chase, so why not also be able to invoke their Cunning Action or Ki? So maybe bonus actions don't actually "drop off" here? Maybe I'm missing something.
It's not that time, itself, is treated differently. It's that different assumptions apply in each situation. A rogue certainly can run 90 feet in six seconds outside of combat. It's just that we're not really tracking fatigue in combat, since it's over so quickly, while we can't ignore fatigue over long distances.Sprinting for 2 rounds would be combat time, not overland travel. I don't like that tactical time is treated differently than not tactical time. I feel like the Round < Minute < Hour conversions are easy enough.