D&D 5E The cost of D&D 5E (it ain't so bad!)

Mercurius

Legend
Yeah, but what I find curious is that the MM and DMG are currently $40.55 and $38.86 respectively yet all three books have the same list price, and are essentially the same length and material input. Intentional pricing on WotC's part, or volume-based supply-demand at Amazon?

One thing to consider is that the PHB comes out in August and the other two a few months later, so maybe the prices will go down.

The problem with everyone jumping aboard this ray of sunshine is that it doesn't change WotC's prices one bit. Yes one distributor has managed to charge less for the product and that is great, but it doesn't mean the prices weren't too high to start with.

Remember that Amazon is the probalby the biggest single avenue for sales for WotC books, so they had to take Amazon's pricing into account with their MSRP. So let's say they priced it what you expected/hoped to begin with: 35 or 40 bucks. 40% of those prices is $21 and $24 respectively. Dial those back to 2008 prices and we're talking $19 and $22, which is kind of cheap, no? So WotC priced it at $50 fully knowing that Amazon would be charging $30.
 

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John-Andre

First Post
Given all the responses from people which overwhelmingly said "I am fine with the $50 price, maybe a tad taken back but I will pay it anyway", I don't see why you think it was a boneheaded decision.

I'm not fine with the $50 price tag. That's still a hefty chunk of monthly budget for me. If I can get the book for free, I'll take it. Now, I'm not saying I'll resort to crime to get it. There will be giveaways. I get gifts. I sometimes receive compensation for my GMing time (running official events for my FLGS). There are avenues, legal and illegal, to get overpriced books.
 

Mistwell

Crusty Old Meatwad (he/him)
I'm not fine with the $50 price tag. That's still a hefty chunk of monthly budget for me. If I can get the book for free, I'll take it. Now, I'm not saying I'll resort to crime to get it. There will be giveaways. I get gifts. I sometimes receive compensation for my GMing time (running official events for my FLGS). There are avenues, legal and illegal, to get overpriced books.

Welcome to the boards.
 

Ichneumon

First Post
If you pay $50 for a core book, there's an excellent chance that you are choosing to pay $50 rather than going with a cheaper alternative like Amazon. Especially if you're commenting here, which indicates you have access to a computing device, and therefore Amazon - unless the site's blocked on every device you have access to.

So if you want to rail against the $50 price point, remember that you're doing so on behalf of a whole group of people who are willingly stumping up the cash.
 

Mistwell

Crusty Old Meatwad (he/him)
If you pay $50 for a core book, there's an excellent chance that you are choosing to pay $50 rather than going with a cheaper alternative like Amazon. Especially if you're commenting here, which indicates you have access to a computing device, and therefore Amazon - unless the site's blocked on every device you have access to.

The PHB is also now $32 on Barnes and Noble online.
 

SteveC

Doing the best imitation of myself
TL : DR - Priced too high, won't actually get much use out of the books even if I do play.

I have to say that this price point is terrible, and it's way too much.

WotC is raising their prices to levels that are compatible with companies that typically have print runs an order of magnitude smaller. As a result, the cost for printing their books is significantly smaller than anyone else, with the possible exception of the Pathfinder books, and I expect that even Paizo has shorter print runs.

I'm a professional adult, and I can afford to buy the books. At the same time, a $150 purchase is something I actually have to account for. It's not a trivial amount of money for me. The notion of commonly spending that kind of money for a night out... does not happen for me. I'm fortunate enough to live in the Midwest, but these book prices aren't comparable with other things I do to socialize with the wife and our friends. Movies for me are $10 or 5 for a matinee.

But the real issue for me is, the cost is high, and how much use am I going to get out of the books? There seems to be this notion that I'm going to get months or even years of play out of the PHB. I'm going to call shenanigans on that.

What do I mean? Well, from the playtest, I can say that I know how to play this new edition of the game. I'm not going to be reading a large portion of the book even a single time, because I don't need it. I know what a fighter or an elf is. I'm going to look at the game effects, for those classes or races, which I will probably soon memorize. I'm sorry, but there's nothing that I've seen that makes me think I'll oou and ahhh at the description. For the record, I did find myself reading the whole 13th Age corebook, but there's nothing that says this edition will be so evocative in the writing style. I think WotC has made the deliberate decision not to write that way.

What I will need to look at is the powers or spell lists, but how often will I even be doing that? I'm sure there will be an online summary for the spells, and how much do I really care what gust of wind does these days? As splat books come out, I'm sure that there will simply be better spells out there than what's in the PHB. I know that's typically how the editions work. Does $50 seem a bit much for some lists of spells? It does to me...

So I buy the PHB, and probably actually refer to it for two or three months before it goes into the library with a lot of my earlier edition stuff. For me the utility is NOT going to be "years of use" in any way. So great value for many moons to come? Not so much. For the other books, it's worse: do I really need to learn about the different playstyles yet again? Do I need to read the same advice on making a game interesting yet again? And for monsters, how much of this stuff do I really need to repurchase, especially now that many monsters are just a bundle of hit points mechanics wise?

Okay, let's look at people other than me, though, since I am definitely not the Alpha and Omega of gamers:

For someone new to RPGs, or for a parent who has a child who wants to get into it, the core rulebook price is going to be a serious barrier. If you want to go beyond the starter set (which seems quite reasonable at $20) you're staring down a significant amount of money. I did a quick survey of the parents in my office and asked them how often they let their kids spend $150. It was not a popular option. The starter set was a winner, but moving on the full game at a full price ... I was told this was unlikely, and that was by some parents who are also gamers.

For someone who wants to dabble in the new edition, I suppose that's the starter set. At the same time, how much play will we really get out of that? Unless it's something very different than other starter sets, it's a feeder to the core books. And we come back to the high pricepoint. Are there really a lot of people who put in $150 to "dabble" or check out something?

Now there is another option at this point to get the books, and that's Amazon. The problem is Amazon does nothing to support my FLGS, and I want to support them. Supporting them to the tune of around $50 dollars, however... wow. I would be more likely to purchase another, different game from them.

And there's the final option: PDFs. I expect they'll turn up at about $25 a piece, which is high (that would be the most I've ever paid for a PDF) but it may be the option I end up taking. That also doesn't put money into my FLGS' pocket, so I'll have to think about it.

So I guess, for me it's definitely a lot of money, and the price point is too high. If it's comparable to common expenses where you live, I can definitely understand how the price isn't an issue. All I'll say about that is I'm glad I don't live in such an expensive location...

And as I'm reading this, it sounds more than a little snarky. If you're excited about the next edition, and think this is a small price to pay for months or years of good gaming, more power to you. Enjoy: it's all good. That's just not me.
 
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sunshadow21

Explorer
If you pay $50 for a core book, there's an excellent chance that you are choosing to pay $50 rather than going with a cheaper alternative like Amazon. Especially if you're commenting here, which indicates you have access to a computing device, and therefore Amazon - unless the site's blocked on every device you have access to.

So if you want to rail against the $50 price point, remember that you're doing so on behalf of a whole group of people who are willingly stumping up the cash.

Or more likely won't buy the books at all. The challenge is that while it's probably a decent price point from WotC's perspective, it's not a good price point to convince people to make it their second or third campaign on their list of priorities, and that is going to hurt WotC in the long run, just like it did with 4E. A lot of what made 3E the success it was, and what makes Paizo successful, is the people that buy the PHB, maybe the rest of the core books eventually, and the occasional supplement from time to time. That's not going to happen much at $50 for each core book and $30 per adventure. Using Amazon as an example of why it's not a problem doesn't work because the only people buying from Amazon are those that are already convinced they want to buy it, not the much, much larger crowd still sitting on the fence in terms of both price and quality of content. I don't think the price WotC set is by itself a major game breaker, but you can't completely dismiss it at the same time. It is a notable price that can amplify other concerns to the point where the price could become an issue by itself if WotC isn't careful.
 

delericho

Legend
Remember that Amazon is the probalby the biggest single avenue for sales for WotC books, so they had to take Amazon's pricing into account with their MSRP. So let's say they priced it what you expected/hoped to begin with: 35 or 40 bucks. 40% of those prices is $21 and $24 respectively. Dial those back to 2008 prices and we're talking $19 and $22, which is kind of cheap, no? So WotC priced it at $50 fully knowing that Amazon would be charging $30.

Why on Earth would WotC care what discounts Amazon offer? They (WotC) get the same money either way, so the only effect of a discount is that Amazon are denying themselves money to get a sale. (Which, AFAIK is still Amazon's business model - make virtually no profit, but hoover up all the sales to become the biggest guys around.)

(Edit: reading it back, that last paragraph feels much more snarky than I'd intended. Sorry. I meant it as an honest question: why would WotC care, if they're getting the same money either way?)

The major effect of this fairly-high price coupled with Amazon's huge discounts is that it's going to drive a huge chunk of the "undecided" and "yes, but not at that price" market away from their FLGS and into the arms of Amazon. Which is really unfortunate, especially with a new D&D PHB being the single biggest RPG item for years on either side - that's money few FLGS can really afford to lose. (For a few bucks difference, I can see a bunch of people deciding to get the book 11 days early from their FLGS; for $20, I really can't see it.)

(I have other issues with Amazon, but those are getting into the political and so this isn't the place. And, of course, I'm probably going to buy from them myself - I don't pretend to be without hypocrisy.)
 


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