D&D 5E Analyzing 5E: Overpowered by design

Sunseeker · Feb 24, 2015

SirAntoine said:
I don't look at it this way. I doubt the designers themselves would, either. Whether anything in particular is over-powered has always been one of the criteria for a DM to make a change. The designers probably make modifications at each of their own tables.

Personal opinion doesn't make things overpowered. By that argument we could turn the whole thing on it's head and say instead not that the edition is overpowered, but that "your" idea of "powered" is actually under-powered.

Sunseeker · Feb 24, 2015

SirAntoine said:
Power-building and clever optimizing aren't problems for me. I object to fundamental things like cantrips being at-will, even at 1st level, and ability score increases.

That's nice. You're a little late to that party by about a decade for the first and almost two decades for the latter. If 5th edition isn't your edition of choice I don't really care, you're welcome to play whatever edition you like the best. 5E is out and we're no longer in the playtest. The rules are the rules. Feel free to change them of course that's your business, but kindly don't tell me the edition is wrong because you don't like some of it's components, I'm not interested in a pointless exchange of opinions.

Diamabel · Feb 24, 2015

keterys said:
You want to be careful about both. If HP inflate too high, it makes some damages feel fairly meaningless ("I've hit this guy with 5 cantrips already and it's not below half hp yet!"), and breaks some spells (ex: Sleep, Power Words).

AC being too low also contributes to some of the the more optimizable strategies around Sharpshooter and Great Weapon Master, where you're okay with a -5 to hit because ACs just don't scale that much. Even a couple higher makes a big difference there. Monsters with a couple uses of Shield work great, too.

Indeed, you don't want to inflate HP too high.. just high enough so the combat lasts as many rounds as you need it to.

HP also mitigates all damage, not just damage that requires attack rolls.

Conversely, if you want combat to be decided by effects like sleep, AC increases are better toward that end.

evilbob · Feb 24, 2015

Celtavian said:
I've noticed that 5E is designed to be played fast and furious. Players are able to carve through enemies and recover at a much faster pace than previous versions of D&D save for perhaps 4E (excluding 4E because I have very little experience with it

Pretty much you stated the answer to your own implied question right there, although I haven't looked through 12 pages to see if anyone else has pointed this out yet (I'm sure they have). 4.0 was a whole lot more "powerful" than previous editions. If you never played 4.0, then 5.0 is understandably a shock, although to hear someone call 5.0 overpowered is a bit odd-sounding if you do have experience with 4.0. (And of course, all of this is relative, semantics, and whatnot.)

There are several options to make the game grittier in the DMG; others have probably posited a few of their own. The most important thing to take away is: the game is intended to be modded, and it is only as good as you make it. If something doesn't sit well with you, feel free to change it up, but you shouldn't have to change much to get the feel you want. Messing with healing may be enough to get the feel you want; good luck.

pemerton · Feb 24, 2015

Tormyr said:
Fighting with witty one-liners? There's a class for that.

I think [MENTION=3887]Mallus[/MENTION] uses the whole game for that!

EzekielRaiden · Feb 24, 2015

evilbob said:
Pretty much you stated the answer to your own implied question right there, although I haven't looked through 12 pages to see if anyone else has pointed this out yet (I'm sure they have). 4.0 was a whole lot more "powerful" than previous editions. If you never played 4.0, then 5.0 is understandably a shock, although to hear someone call 5.0 overpowered is a bit odd-sounding if you do have experience with 4.0. (And of course, all of this is relative, semantics, and whatnot.)

Yeah, I covered this in post 11 (though I don't think even 4e is 'overpowered,' so there's that). I got a big fat "you missed the point, so I'm ignoring everything you said" response. Kinda reduced my desire to participate much further.

There are several options to make the game grittier in the DMG; others have probably posited a few of their own. The most important thing to take away is: the game is intended to be modded, and it is only as good as you make it. If something doesn't sit well with you, feel free to change it up, but you shouldn't have to change much to get the feel you want. Messing with healing may be enough to get the feel you want; good luck.

Sucks for the people who either don't want, or lack the time, to mod the game, doesn't it?

abelmort · Feb 25, 2015

SirAntoine said:
Power-building and clever optimizing aren't problems for me. I object to fundamental things like cantrips being at-will, even at 1st level, and ability score increases.

My impression has been that the damage of cantrips (outside of warlocks) is not that impressive. Before level 5, many wizards can do better damage with a light crossbow. If it is just an issue of theme, then we can agree to disagree. I enjoy having a caster who has something to cast every round even if it is a minor damage or effect.

SirAntoine · Feb 25, 2015

shidaku said:
Personal opinion doesn't make things overpowered. By that argument we could turn the whole thing on it's head and say instead not that the edition is overpowered, but that "your" idea of "powered" is actually under-powered.

That is how I have received your reply. It is all about personal opinion.

SirAntoine · Feb 25, 2015

shidaku said:
That's nice. You're a little late to that party by about a decade for the first and almost two decades for the latter. If 5th edition isn't your edition of choice I don't really care, you're welcome to play whatever edition you like the best. 5E is out and we're no longer in the playtest. The rules are the rules. Feel free to change them of course that's your business, but kindly don't tell me the edition is wrong because you don't like some of it's components, I'm not interested in a pointless exchange of opinions.

My opinion counts as much as anyone else's.

Remathilis · Feb 25, 2015

SirAntoine said:
My opinion counts as much as anyone else's.

True, but just like the guy who argues Thief shouldn't be a character class or Halfling a race, you have to accept its a minority view.

Don't be surprised when most people don't agree or think it needs fixing.

D&D 5E Analyzing 5E: Overpowered by design

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