Why is WotC trying to kill my FLGS?

[Dire Bare]

I am not advocating anything really. You say I am advocating. I was just trying to say what different possibilities are out there and that everyone has its role. Perhaps for Wotc is working out now in a certain way. But there can be various strategic decisions/options. Sometimes you need to experiment too.
Remember though that Wotc as a capitalist entity thinks primarily about its profits and capital (short and long term), not about the hobby's long terms. It can very well take its capital and invest to a totally different thing.

Actually, WotC is rather supportive of the FLGS retail market and fully realizes that game stores are vital to introducing new players to WotC's flagship games, D&D, Magic, and others. They care about the industry as a whole because D&D IS the largest part of the RPG industry, just as Magic IS the largest part of the CCG industry.

WotC offers extensive retailer support thru the RPGA and other in-store marketing campaigns such as Worldwide D&D Day. Your big box retailers like Borders and B&N don't participate in these, and Amazon certainly does not. However, with RPGs there is just no feasible way that WotC can help retailers vs Amazon when it comes to price.

WotC's retail support for Magic is even better, but Magic boosters and decks are rarely discounted online to the same level Amazon discounts game books.

Do you know what really kills most local game stores? Poor business practices. In my town at least three game stores curled up and died over the past several years, and in each case it was because they offered poor customer service and did not take full advantage of the strengths of brick-and-mortar stores (they also did not take advantage of WotC's promotions and marketing help).

We have one major game store that has survived so far (two if I count Hobbytown), and that store offers a clean, well lit, friendly (non-stinky) environment with helpful sales staff, a huge gaming area for RPGs, card games, board games and etc, and offers demos for many games. (although sadly, they too often ignore much of the marketing help WotC offers for both Magic and D&D, and even industry help like Free RPG Day, and today I had my first crappy customer service experience there too).

 

[Lord Xtheth]

In before the lock.

The title of the thread is ridiculous. It could just of well been titled "AnothyRobeson is trying to kill his FLGS because he likes paying less for books and is shopping at Amazon."

If you don't like a particular retailer, don't buy from it.
If you don't like a price of a book, don't buy it (or look for it somewhere else).

Personally, sometimes I will pay more to support a local business and/or get the better service and sometime I mail order just to get it for as cheap as possible.

Winner!

 

[xechnao]

This thread is kind of funny.

On the MTG boards, there's ALWAYS griping about how WOTC favours the brick and mortar stores (from the cost of MTG:Online to the tournament structure, WOTC has tried to boost the FLGS).

Now here, we have a thread where people are moaning abot WOTC trying to kill off the FLGS through D&D.

As for WOTC's dislike of internet retailers, I thought it wasn't because of the price point (WOTC gets the same cut if they sell their boosters to either a brick & mortar or internet store). It's the belief that internet stores don't drive the business for future sales.

Such as providing environments for gamers to meet such as tournaments and even for a way to capture a gamer's attention (I've known a couple of people that got into MTG from going into a FLGS for another game and being intrigued by watching some guys play MTG)

Very interesting and informational post. Well it seems Wotc is behaving like it has decided that D&D selling and promotional business now is more an online internet front than anything. So far it seems 4e launch and launch sales have been based more on internet than FLGS. I suspect part of things could also be a result of the D20 glut problem and generally the OGL effect. The DDI implementation at this point is also important. Since D&D is a strategic brand this could potentially be a telling sign IMO. But eventually it would not be that hard for Wotc to change policy in the future if it so wants I think... supposing FLGS exist till that point.

 

[xechnao]

WotC's retail support for Magic is even better, but Magic boosters and decks are rarely discounted online to the same level Amazon discounts game books.

This is what we are or want to talk about in the thread.

 

[xechnao]

I buy local when it truly is local: farmers' markets, and other such local producers. I do not care especially about buying local when it's a local purveyor of a translocal product. I have no incentive at all to waste (an admittedly very small amount of) gas to travel to any of the several game stores in the local area when such a large fraction of the cover price goes to WotC, to a book distributor, or to other translocal entities. When most of my buying dollar is sent outside of my community, my reason to buy "local" goes away with it.

Services are important too. It is not only about production. Yet the right owners of a product could make more money out of it. I do not see where your problem is.

 

[Dire Bare]

This is what we are or want to talk about in the thread.

True . . . but did you read the rest of my post, about the awesome WotC retail support for D&D?

 

[Dire Bare]

Very interesting and informational post. Well it seems Wotc is behaving like it has decided that D&D selling and promotional business now is more an online internet front than anything. So far it seems 4e launch and launch sales have been based more on internet than FLGS. I suspect part of things could also be a result of the D20 glut problem and generally the OGL effect. The DDI implementation at this point is also important. Since D&D is a strategic brand this could potentially be a telling sign IMO. But eventually it would not be that hard for Wotc to change policy in the future if it so wants I think... supposing FLGS exist till that point.

WotC convincing you to subscribe to the online D&D Insider has absolutlely no relation to whether you purchase your print books at the local game store or thru Amazon. WotC sells their products thru Amazon, obviously, but would actually prefer you help keep the local game store alive. It's better for WotC's bottom line for ALL of their games, as new players are rarely introduced to D&D or any of WotC's games thru Amazon or other online retailers. WotC can't ignore Amazon or refuse that sales outlet, as it is huge, but they are very active in retail support. If you have a SFLGS (Smart, Friendly, Local Game Store) in your area, go ask them!

 

[xechnao]

WotC convincing you to subscribe to the online D&D Insider has absolutlely no relation to whether you purchase your print books at the local game store or thru Amazon. WotC sells their products thru Amazon, obviously, but would actually prefer you help keep the local game store alive. It's better for WotC's bottom line for ALL of their games, as new players are rarely introduced to D&D or any of WotC's games thru Amazon or other online retailers. WotC can't ignore Amazon or refuse that sales outlet, as it is huge, but they are very active in retail support. If you have a SFLGS (Smart, Friendly, Local Game Store) in your area, go ask them!

It has an environmental relation. It is online. Amazon is online too. See how console video games industry prefer to sell to public by DVDs rather than downloads. Wotc could have also chosen to sell the virtual game table and generator with a physical DVD format on a smaller price than an online subscription and sell it through stores only. Yet they chose the subscription way. Perhaps piracy could be a problem to DVDs though?

 

[Dire Bare]

It has an environmental relation. It is online. Amazon is online too. See how console video games industry prefer to sell to public by DVDs rather than downloads. Wotc could have also chosen to sell the virtual game table and generator with a physical DVD format on a smaller price than an online subscription and sell it through stores only. Yet they chose the subscription way. Perhaps piracy could be a problem to DVDs though?

Environmental relation? Not really. By that argument the online PDFs sold thru Drivethrurpgnow.com would be WotC's preferred method of selling their books, but it's not. Heck, they could have made everything an online subscription, with no print books at all!

WotC's primary goal is to sell you print D&D books, no matter where you purchase them. Their secondary goal is to get as many of us as possible to subscribe to D&DI. And a third goal is to support business through the gamestore retail channel, where it is easy to introduce new players to the game and keep existing players playing.

The reason why they chose a subscription format rather than a DVD format also had nothing to do with Amazon. It's simple, really. They stand to make a LOT more money with an online subscription service than they would with a DVD distributed through retail stores (which would probably also be sold thru Amazon at a huge discount anyway).

 

[xechnao]

Environmental relation? Not really. By that argument the online PDFs sold thru Drivethrurpgnow.com would be WotC's preferred method of selling their books, but it's not. Heck, they could have made everything an online subscription, with no print books at all!

WotC's primary goal is to sell you print D&D books, no matter where you purchase them. Their secondary goal is to get as many of us as possible to subscribe to D&DI. And a third goal is to support business through the gamestore retail channel, where it is easy to introduce new players to the game and keep existing players playing.

The reason why they chose a subscription format rather than a DVD format also had nothing to do with Amazon. It's simple, really. They stand to make a LOT more money with an online subscription service than they would with a DVD distributed through retail stores (which would probably also be sold thru Amazon at a huge discount anyway).

Wotc primary goal is to sell. Period. The other goals are more connected among them. Thus the importance of environment.

PDF books are not an optimal product IMO. Optimal media for reading and perhaps combined with illsutration art and owning and showing such illustrations to your friends is better done by a physical book. Optimal for calculating, various applications and media are machines and computers. Then there is the piracy problem. I think people tend to feel differently regarding things build on digital. I suspect more people could feel less loss to download the illegal pdf a month or half a month later if they knew that there is no other value to own such as the one attached to physical media. OTOH the bigger the perceived value of a product the more disposed people seem to be to diminish any loss regarding it (and thus immediate -albeit more costly- seem more appealing).
This is one thing.
The other thing is (which is connected to the previous one) that things exposed beyond your PC screen such as books promote better your product and in many cases (many at 100%) strongly sustain your market.

Regarding DVDs and amazon prices. Well this is what we are talking about first place. If amazon competition with brick and mortar did not matter there would be no need of DVDs either of course thus my argument would be moot as you say it is. But it is not because this is what we are talking about.