4E, as an anti-4E guy ...

[Treebore]

Yep, 4E isn't a bad game, it just isn't one of my top 5. I'll play it on D&D Game Days and participate in the DCI on that basis, its simply not my favorite "brand name" game anymore. It is, in and of itself, a good game, though, so having fun with it is no surprise to me. I manage to have fun with it when I play.

 

[Silvercat Moonpaw]

Pardon my curiosity here. If you hate tactics, what sort of combat roleplaying do you prefer? Are you looking for something like narrative combat, where the player is rewarded for hitting whoever it would be most dramatic to hit, or you move around the battlefield based on what would be the most visually interesting movement?

Tactical decisions are an integral part of dealing with a combat scene with a game as the medium. I'm kind of interested in how you could drop tactics out of the mix and still have something like a game left.

I take "tactics" to mean "having to think about what you are doing in the middle". Or at all, for that matter. Attacks of Opportunity/Opportunity Attacks and limited uses mean you have to control yourself. I hate that. I'd much rather just be able to make snap decisions and be all impulsive.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I'd much rather just be able to make snap decisions and be all impulsive.

You can do that. It will have consequences, but you can do that.

 

[Silvercat Moonpaw]

You can do that. It will have consequences, but you can do that.

I don't want the consequences. Because they intrude on the non-thinking process.

 

[RefinedBean]

I don't want the consequences. Because they intrude on the non-thinking process.

So you...don't want consequences for your actions?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Consequences aren't necessarily bad, you know.

Doing the unexpected- possibly even tactically unsound- may disrupt your enemy's plan.

In a game of Chess, I once sacrificed a Queen and a Bishop to advance a Pawn.

The player was so distracted by these seemingly insane moves that I was able to advance that Pawn to fork his Queen and King with it...which also opened up a lane to have another Pawn advanced to his last row and become a new Queen.

A better player would have noticed the danger and passed up the attack on the Queen to take the Pawn, and probably kicked my butt when my gamble failed.

In the RW, there was a naval battle in WW2 in which a sizeable Japanese fleet built around one of their huge battleships encountered a small American fleet of destroyers and frigates

One of the small ships broke off and actually attacked the much more powerful Japanese fleet by itself, and inflicted damage...allowing the rest of the American fleet to gather itself and essentially give the Japanese a nasty poke in the eye with a sharp stick.

 

[Silvercat Moonpaw]

So you...don't want consequences for your actions?

I was speaking specifically about D&D: I want to play combat non-tactically, Dannyalcatraz said that would result in consequences, I interpreted that to mean it can't be effectively done. I want to fight non-tactically and still be an effective fighter.

 

[Silvercat Moonpaw]

In a game of Chess………

And the version of Chess I'd prefer to play has all the pieces rushing to crash in a great big melee in the middle and the winner is the side that doesn't lose everyone.

Otherwise I don't see a point to fighting. It's just too stupid an action any other way.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I want to fight non-tactically and still be an effective fighter.

You want the moon on a stick, you do.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERDUbAv8Qz0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERDUbAv8Qz0[/ame]

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

And the version of Chess I'd prefer to play has all the pieces rushing to crash in a great big melee in the middle and the winner is the side that doesn't lose everyone.

Otherwise I don't see a point to fighting. It's just too stupid an action any other way.

War is stupid, to be sure.

But barbarian tactics work best against barbarians. When Boudicca (a.k.a. Bodicea) sent her forces against the disciplined Roman forces in Briton at the time, they got turned into crow food.

Tuoborg Forest was a different story- those Roman Legions were Legions in name only, lacking the superior equipment, discipline and tactics of previous ages.

The Barbarian of D&D is anything but tactical. He's a shock trooper, and very effective because of it. However, given time, tactics and discipline, he can be brought down despite his ferocity...or even because of it.