What D&Disms have you never liked?

[JohnSnow]

Oddly, I'd say that D&D's common tongue has its roots in Tolkien's Westron, which was even called "the common speech."

My pet peeves for years have been Vancian magic and the arcane/divine magic divide (without any real distinction between the two). I never understood why, with all the "healing wizards" in fantasy, D&D never embraced the concept. Other than that, I guess it's the overabundance of magic items. Most D&D characters are decked in magical wardrobes, and carrying golfbags full of magic weapons. Compared to most fantasy, it's a bit jarring. In recent years, I've noticed a stronger "wizards uber alles" trend that bugged me.

That said, one of the things I like about Fourth Edition is that it just about (although not quite...) put a bullet in the head of Vancian magic. The downside was an unfortunate drop in spell diversity, but so far, I'm coping. Rituals are a good system that can fill that gap...but still need some work. And oddly, I'm more okay with the divide now that there's more kinds of magic. Which is weird, I know.

Magic items still need some work (although even they've taken, IMO, a step in the right direction). All in all though, I think the fact that 4e addressed many of those issues, took a stab at juicing up the fighter types, simplified monster/NPC design, and ditched iterative attacks is why I've embraced it as much as I have. They took aim at a lot of my nagging problems with Third Edition and hit like 4 of 6 bullseyes. Some other issues (like monsters that were more than just "critters to kill") took a hit, but that's in many ways easier for me to fix than something as fundamental as the game's magic system and class power balance.

Prior to 3e, it always bugged me that D&D lacked a comprehensive skill system. Non-Weapon Proficiencies just never quite cut it. Some things I love 3e for fixing, even though they never bothered me way back when, like the introduction of BAB and the streamlining down to 3 saves. I'm not sure the defense thing isn't better, mind you, but Fort/Ref/Will beat the tar out of the old mix of Spells/RSW/DM/BW and PPP.

Funnily enough, the abstract combat system has never bothered me, despite me being a martial arts (in fact, swordfighting) geek. I guess I'm knowledgeable enough to realize that any attempt at "realism" would be supremely unsatisfying. And I fiddled with various Palladium games enough to know that added complexity isn't always a good thing.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

- Vancian Magic. That was a difficult one for me, since my first RPG was Shadowrun, and that magic system is drain-based.
- +X Items. It's videogamey. Except, it turns out, it is something the original RPG introduced!

And then there is something that is not exactly a D&Dism, but more an "RPGism":
Magic is Artillery. Seriously, how much stories about witches and spellcasters really contain the mage slinging fireballs? Maybe today there is more of them, but the "fairy tale/myth" origins don't seem to contain much of them. <insert generic Gandalf/Merlin comparision here>.

 

[Leatherhead]

Seriously, how much stories about witches and spellcasters really contain the mage slinging fireballs? Maybe today there is more of them, but the "fairy tale/myth" origins don't seem to contain much of them. <insert generic Gandalf/Merlin comparision here>.

Ah yes, fireballs. I hate fireball spells, in video games, where they do nothing more than fire elemental damage instead of "sword elemental" damage. But that has more to do with my dislike of hps (and direct-damage spells serving no other function than removing hps), than the idea of magic raining fire from above.

In DnD, they are not nearly as bad, because you can actually set things on fire with them. Heck, even vanilla melee damage isn't quite as bad in DnD as it is in video games. In DnD you can use an axe to chop down any support beam at least.

 

[Starfox]

I guess I should add obligatory armor to my list of pewees - tough its only partially a DnD-ism.

Also armoured clerics. Why the heck are all all clerics heavily armoured warriors? I never like that particular assumption and feel that niche should have been left to the paladin or allowed via some sort of multiclassing or the like. IMHO unarmoured clerics are a much more rational default assumption.

Somehow, this didn't bother me until 4E. I guess that says more about me and my changing tastes than about 4E. IMC right now, only one character (out of 10 in two campaigns, one 3.5 and one 4E) wears heavier armor than Chain Shirt and most wear no armor.

 

[Starfox]

I've never really cared for the almost utopian integration of races in default D&D. I understand why the choice was made, but it makes me cringe. Were all big boys and girls, and I think we can deal with some institutional dwarf-hatin', right?

It may be nostalgic BS, but it seems like it's gotten worse and worse through iterations of the game. Again, possibly just nostalgia, but the races seem to feel more and more like, "99 percent human, 1 percent <insert racial quirk here>."

Maybe a disposition towards bigotry and racial hatred is a human trait and not nearly as present in non-humans? I think the players can introduce all the hate they need themselves into the game, without putting it into the rules.

"Yeah, it was your choice to play the dwarf, now the rest of us get to ridicule you because of it" doesn't sound like a fun game to me.

 

[Garthanos]

Oddly, I'd say that D&D's common tongue has its roots in Tolkien's Westron, which was even called "the common speech."

... yeah weird eh, in general that diversity and adversity I mentioned is probably not on many peoples fun fantasy list.

My pet peeves for years have been Vancian magic and the arcane/divine magic divide (without any real distinction between the two). I never understood why, with all the "healing wizards" in fantasy, D&D never embraced the concept.

One mans witchcraft is another divined holy one. Historically the divide between the two was generally an ally or adversary (just as one mans god gets reworked as the others devil). Healing is probably the most common magic in myth and legend look at those practicing faith healing... see they can blame failures on the subject and people do heal faster when they want to and believe they will.

 

[Hussar]

Here is a D&Dism I have not been fond of... the ubiquitous language common tongue.
I also understand why its done... But I liked tolkeins languages and designed a dragon language back in high school (for fun before doing much roleplaying).... so I might be an odd man out but a little linguistic diversity and adversity once in a while can be fun.

Reading through the thread, nothing made me nod more than this one. I HATE the language rules in D&D. Hate, hate, hate. Common? Grrrr.

The Save or Die thing has always bugged me.

Level drain. Have hated that for a long, long time. House ruled it years ago to be healable (late 1e or early 2e was when I made that change) and have rarely used level draining monsters in the game.

Psionics. I've just never liked it. If I wanted a spell point system in my game, I'd get one. Keep your quasi-SF chocolate out of my peanut butter.

 

[FireLance]

I'm not sure that I can think of a so-called "D&Dism" that I actually dislike.

Of all the elements that have been mentioned so far, even the one I dislike the most, save or die, is much better (IMO) than the literary (or historical, or mythological) inspiration: die, no save.

Almost everything else, I'm at least neutral to. Hit points? Vancian spellcasting? Clerics? Paladins? Dual-wielding rangers? Races living in harmony? +X magic items? Loads and loads of magic items? It's all good.

I may encounter people who play D&D in a way that I would dislike, e.g. DMs and players who prioritize their fun over the fun of everyone else at the table, but that doesn't make it a "D&Dism".

 

[Garthanos]

Reading through the thread, nothing made me nod more than this one. I HATE the language rules in D&D. Hate, hate, hate. Common? Grrrr.

Ubiquity of a common language implies a ton of travel ... not very medieval eh.

 

[Garthanos]

And then there is something that is not exactly a D&Dism, but more an "RPGism":
Magic is Artillery. Seriously, how much stories about witches and spellcasters really contain the mage slinging fireballs? Maybe today there is more of them, but the "fairy tale/myth" origins don't seem to contain much of them. <insert generic Gandalf/Merlin comparision here>.

There is literary precident for big obvious battle magics. The wizards in the Thomas Covenant series or those in the sword of truth series or those in Ursula K Leguins novels.
oh...
And Gandalf in the hobbit struck down the goblins in the caves with flashes of lightning... before vanishing to avoid capture and later Gandalf plucked acorns from the tree and hurled them as fire in to the orcs ... those not killed promptly used the handy flames to bon fire the tree... umm tactical failure? This was before the discovery that the one ring had awakened and the lurking presence of the eye of Sauron became a serious reason not to take the obvious route with active magics. .. so a sword Glamdring which made your attacks into divine white light which burned children of the dark but passed under the magic sensing radar... seemed to make sense... the weapon returns with him after he becomes gandalf the white, and establishes itself as very definitely part of the character. Gandalf moved about the world faster than normal folk thought possible.. was he travelling fey paths? (sure -- literary excuses are not that great to apply to pc heros... they got this power because they want to use it but the primordial wizard was still portrayed as being able to throw fire balls and lightning).

I find the ancient celtic legends fit rather well with modern D&D even there warrior heros were trained by war witches... I am certain they were not shy about making magic big and bold lighting and storm pulled from the sky... nor was it something that out shined their heros of muscle and blood and blade. CuhCulaine and his ilk, had bizzare things he did like spouts of burning blood from his head ... running on the tips of enemy spears and warping under the strain of supernaturally boosted strength in battlerages. (The recent barbarian class feels over all very Celtic).