[Playtest 2] Weapons and Armor

[JoeCrow]

Not entirely happy with the new armor selection, myself. So, I reworked it a bit. Focused more on actual historical armor names, and tried to work up an even progression for mundane armor. I'll work up a similar table for more unusual sorts of armor, your mithrils and dragonscales and whatnot, later. What do you folks think?

Common Armor

Name

Light armor Price Armor Class Wgt Speed Stealth
Padded Jack 25 sp 11 + Dex - -
Leather Jack 10 gp 12 + Dex - -
Brigandine* 25 gp 13 + Dex - -
Chain Shirt 100 gp 14 + Dex - -

Medium armor
Hide 15 gp 13 + max 2 Dex - -
Scale 50 gp 14 + max 2 Dex - -
Breastplate 200 gp 15 + max 2 Dex - -

Heavy armor
Chain Hauberk 150 gp 15 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv
Laminar** 500 gp 16 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv
Plate 1500 gp 17 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv

Shield
Buckler 15 gp +1 (vs 1 att)
Light Shield 10 gp +1
Heavy Shield 25 gp +2


*Studded Leather
**Splint/Banded

 

[Chronikoce]

[MENTION=1302]JoeCrow[/MENTION] I don't understand why you raised the highest AC light armor by 1 and lowered the highest AC heavy armor by 1. I don't think you should do that at all. Your current armor list has a character in 100gp Chainmail with a Dex of 16 (easy to get) having the same AC as the guy wearing 1500gp Full Plate. That should absolutely not be the case.

 

[Salamandyr]

They'll never do it, and it would probably be a bad idea to do so, since having evocative names for the armor helps immersion, but I almost wish they would just have 3 categories of armor, based on coverage and let you decide what you're wearing.


Light armor-essentially a breastplate, could be of leather, scale, o of some kind, arms and legs unarmored, maybe a helmet. AC 12+Dex bonus

Types: Leather Jack, Brigandine or Mail Shirt, Breastplate.

Medium- Three Quarter coverage equal to a mail hauberk, greaves and vambrace, and a solid helmet. AC 15+Dex Bonus (max 2)

Types: Half Plate, mail hauberk and ancillaries, coat of plates with vambrace and greaves.

Heavy-Full cap a pied, head to toe armor AC 18 (no dex bonus)

Types: Any combination of Mail, Plate, and Scale that covers the body completely.

Basically the DM decides what type of armor is common in his game world for each Level.

 

[JoeCrow]

[MENTION=1302]JoeCrow[/MENTION] I don't understand why you raised the highest AC light armor by 1 and lowered the highest AC heavy armor by 1. I don't think you should do that at all. Your current armor list has a character in 100gp Chainmail with a Dex of 16 (easy to get) having the same AC as the guy wearing 1500gp Full Plate. That should absolutely not be the case.

Well, I was trying to give folks the basic options for your standard late Medieval/early Renaissance fantasy trip, based on what D&D's offered for armor from 1st through 5th editions. Chain shirt shows up in 3rd for the first time as a +4 AC bonus piece of armor, and it's 100 gp. It disappears again in 4th, and then reappears in 5th (the 1st packet) as a 14 AC piece of light armor for 75 gp.

(A chain shirt is pretty much your standard short-sleeved hip-length set of mail, where your chain hauberk is the full long-sleeved, knee-length coat with coif, gauntlets, and maybe leggings.)

I upped the price on the shirt to make it more of an investment for the lower classes, and to reflect the price of the full chain hauberk.

I'm thinking of adjusting the price of scale and breastplate up a bit, too.

Besides, that's the basic array from the initial test packet, with the mithril, dragonscale, and adamantine stuff peeled off, splint and banded combined, and the prices adjusted.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Not entirely happy with the new armor selection, myself. So, I reworked it a bit. Focused more on actual historical armor names, and tried to work up an even progression for mundane armor. I'll work up a similar table for more unusual sorts of armor, your mithrils and dragonscales and whatnot, later. What do you folks think?

You've just made the Chain Shirt the best armor in the game.

 

[JoeCrow]

Well, it's always been a fan favorite. That's why I adjusted the price upwards from the previous versions. What do you think it should be? The 14 AC plus Dex modifier is the way it's been since 3rd, and it used to be cheaper (100 gp in 3rd, 75 gp in the first playtest packet).

Do you think it should be removed altogether, like 4th and the second packet?

 

[ArmoredSaint]

What do you folks think?

I think you must hate heavy armour for some reason...

I'd rather see something like this:

Common Armor

Name Price Armor Class Wgt Speed Stealth

Light armor
Padded Jack 25 sp 11 + Dex - -
Mail Shirt 25 gp 12 + Dex - -
Brigandine 100 gp 13 + Dex - -

Medium armor
Boiled leather 15 gp 13 + max 2 Dex - -
Scale 50 gp 14 + max 2 Dex - -
Breastplate 200 gp 15 + max 2 Dex - -

Heavy armor
Mail Hauberk 150 gp 18 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv
Reinforced mail* 500 gp 19 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv
Plate 1500 gp 20 (no Dex) -5 ft Disadv

Shield
Buckler 15 gp +1 (vs 1 att)
Light Shield 10 gp +1
Heavy Shield 25 gp +2

*encompasses "splint/banded/platemail"

 

[ferratus]

I just want an armour system that gives proper respect to carrying a shield. A shield is often worth as much protection as an entire suit of armour, which is why people carried them. D&D has never, ever given shields the bonus they deserve of +4 AC.

Okay, it might be worth only +2 if you are carrying chain, or +1 if you are carrying plate, but it should significantly increase your AC if you are wearing anything lighter. A good stout wooden shield should be worth wearing 2 boiled leather jerkins, not half of one.

 

[Chronikoce]

The trouble with shields is that I believe their protection varies pretty widely based on the type of shield, the fighting style your using, and the weapon that the enemy is using.

Wooden shields for example were very good defense against slashing weapons. They both served to stop incoming attacks and when the enemy slashed you could get their weapon stuck on their shield and disarm them. However a wooden shield is not nearly as good vs bashing weapons because they would shatter and break (also since the blow is passed through shield and not dispersed well I can't imagine your arm would hold up to too many direct hits).

Metal shields were heavier and slowed you down but offered better protection but without that added benefit of being able to catch an incoming attack and disarm the bad guy when their weapon gets stuck. They also don't do wonderfully due to direct hits from bashing weapons.

If that is TL;DR. Shields should be better than +1 but I think +4 is too high because shields were not always the best choice in combat.

 

[Danzauker]

I'm not completely happy with TWF working only with finesse weapons. This makes some flavourful combinations no more possible, like longsword and handaxe or two handaxes.

I'd personally like to see the light property to come back and have TWF apply if both weapons are light or finesse.

Plus, bastard sword ins only listed as two handed. In this case I think they just forgot a side note telling that it can be used one armed as a longsword. Same thing for the katana, otherwise you can not build the iconic katana / wakizashi wielding samurai.