D&D 5E Is it just me or have rogues lost the ability to climb?

[Uller]

So it seems somewhere along the way we've lost specific skills. If you have a class that is good at things related to an ability score you get an expertise die to get a bonus on all ability checks related to that ability...This is okay I guess, but it seems to me something is missing or I'm completely missing something....

So you have a Dex 18, Str 10 Halfling Rogue. Traditionally, this little guy would have been great at climbing. Somewhere along the way (4e I suppose) Climbing became an athletics check and that was strength...fine...you could still train in it at least so the above halfling could compete with his untrained Str 20 compatriots. But now (and again, perhaps I'm missing something) the rogue climbs as well as the wizard? Something is amiss!

 

[keterys]

Climb became Strength-based in 3e. It is perhaps worth note that in 2e, everyone effectively had a base climb walls of 40% so rogues weren't as impressive at early level as you might think; also halflings took a -15% penalty to climbing, so the halfling rogue wasn't really that exceptional at climbing until later level.

 

[Falling Icicle]

This is why I hate the expertise system. It is no substitute for a skill system. The way it works now, rogues are good at everything possible with Dexterity, which is shallow and boring, but they also don't get to be good at things involving other abilities that they should potentially be, like charisma checks to bluff and disguise, strength checks to climb, wisdom checks to read lips, etc. It also results in absurd things like the Assassin, due to having Int expertise, being better at most Lore than wizards are.

 

[the Jester]

Is there any reason a dm couldn't allow this pc to use his Dex to climb?

 

[n00bdragon]

Is there any reason a dm couldn't allow this pc to use his Dex to climb?

Absolutely none whatsoever, but the ability to house rule a problem with the rules doesn't negate the problem with the rules.

 

[Paraxis]

Is there any reason a dm couldn't allow this pc to use his Dex to climb?

Because the game system that we are tying to beta test says to use Strength for those checks and that is the point of the thread, something is wrong with the game. We should comment on how to fix it now so DM's in the future don't have to come up with this stuff themselves. That is what we buy a game system for after all a clean effective balanced rules system right.

 

[Stalker0]

The problem is even worse for the monk. Since he doesn't get str skills and speed no longer increases jump, he doesn't have climbing or jumping.

 

[MerricB]

Traditionally, this little guy would have been great at climbing.

Only in Basic D&D. In AD&D and every derivations of it, the halfling was only okay at climbing - certainly worse than human thieves.

A few notes:
* In AD&D (1E and 2E) Dexterity did NOT increase the thief skill of climbing, although it increased most of the other thief skills (also not Read Languages and Read Magic).
* In AD&D (1E and 2E) Halflings had a penalty to climbing
* In D&D (3E and 4E) Climb is a Strength-based ability
* In D&D 3E, halflings gained a +2 racial bonus to climb checks (despite being poor at it in AD&D!) which offset the Str penalty

Halfling Thieves were at their worst for climbing in 2E, as they didn't even need to put skill points into the climb skill.

It should be noted that there *will* be a skill system in Next... if you want it. It's one of the modules. (See here)

Cheers!

 

[Kobold Stew]

Rogues have lost it, but can get it back if they have the Bounty Hunter background, which gives proficiency with the climbing kit.

Anyone can be a bounty hunter (even halflings), and with the kit there are no checks (!?).

 

[Li Shenron]

It's one of the reasons why I preferred the (short-lived) version of skills which were not tied to specfic ability scores.