D&D 5E Starter Set Character Sheet Revealed!

[Dausuul]

It's a little wonky in that the intended rest mechanic should be Hit Dice between battles; but I think it will make more sense once we see the "4E conversion" DMG kit, which I suspect makes short rest a 5 minute conversion.

That doesn't really answer the question at all. Whether the length of the short rest is 5 minutes or 1 hour, the point is that if you rest for [double the length of a short rest], you get twice as much benefit if you're jumped by a goblin halfway through.

Alternatively, if you rule that bonus actions can only happen during a fight, or that second wind may only be used in combat, that also fixes the issue.

That makes it even weirder. Now you've got a situation where someone is all beat-up, gets jumped by a goblin, and suddenly feels better.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to have abilities that can only be used "in combat," or that are triggered/reset by going "into combat." I prefer a more fluid approach where combat and noncombat can seamlessly blend into each other.

 

[MoonSong]

And you think cleric players just love being healbots?

Cleric player here, I love being the healbot. And feeling superfluous to the party doesn't makes me happy

 

[Uller]

Yeah...I'm typically in favor of giving the designers the benefit of the doubt but this just seems hokey to me. Simple fix: use of second wind is just a hit die. So basically once per fight a fighter can spend a hit die during combat. I think as this is written it will cause fighters to want rest until they are fully healed if the feel like they have time. There has to be some limiting factor

 

[Dausuul]

Yeah...I'm typically in favor of giving the designers the benefit of the doubt but this just seems hokey to me. Simple fix: use of second wind is just a hit die. So basically once per fight a fighter can spend a hit die during combat. I think as this is written it will cause fighters to want rest until they are fully healed if the feel like they have time. There has to be some limiting factor

This is one good approach.

Another: Taking a short rest requires spending a Hit Die, even if you're already at full hit points. If you're out of Hit Dice, no more short rests.

Another: You get three short rests per day. After you've taken them, you don't get any more until you've had a long rest.

There are lots of options, but they all boil down to "You can only take/benefit from so many short rests, no matter how many fights you get into."

 

[Obryn]

Cleric player here, I love being the healbot. And feeling superfluous to the party doesn't makes me happy

Well, fighter player here. I don't like relying on a cleric to keep me going.

Seriously, though, this is a minor in combat heal, and a way to save some spells (maybe) between fights. In combat healing is still necessary, particularly because only the fighter gets this perk.

 

[hbarsquared]

Yeah...I'm typically in favor of giving the designers the benefit of the doubt but this just seems hokey to me. Simple fix: use of second wind is just a hit die. So basically once per fight a fighter can spend a hit die during combat. I think as this is written it will cause fighters to want rest until they are fully healed if the feel like they have time. There has to be some limiting factor

I'm going to guess that this is exactly the case. Notice that the Second Wind healing amount is the figher's hit die. I imagine it was just simplified for the Starter Set and the pregens.

 

[Uller]

I'm going to guess that this is exactly the case. Notice that the Second Wind healing amount is the figher's hit die. I imagine it was just simplified for the Starter Set and the pregens.

I hope so. I dont like house rules unless they are completely necessary

 

[Dausuul]

I'm going to guess that this is exactly the case. Notice that the Second Wind healing amount is the figher's hit die. I imagine it was just simplified for the Starter Set and the pregens.

Except that the Second Wind ability says nothing about expending a hit die.

As I understood it, the Starter Set was supposed to use the actual D&D rules, not a simplified version of them; that way, players could transition smoothly into the full game. Changing Second Wind from "once per short rest" to "once per short rest and you have to spend a hit die" is a significant nerf, which cuts fighter staying power by quite a bit. I can't believe they would have a gotcha like that. They might hide the nuts and bolts behind how you determine your abilities, but the abilities themselves should match.

 

[lkj]

Except that the Second Wind ability says nothing about expending a hit die.

As I understood it, the Starter Set was supposed to use the actual D&D rules, not a simplified version of them; that way, players could transition smoothly into the full game. Changing Second Wind from "once per short rest" to "once per short rest and you have to spend a hit die" is a major nerf which would substantially affect fighter performance. I can't believe they would have a gotcha like that. They might hide the nuts and bolts behind how you determine your abilities, but the abilities themselves should match.

I agree that this does not at all appear what is intended on the character sheet (i.e., it doesn't drain hit dice). It would be a pretty big nerf (perhaps especially at first level where it'd basically become a daily). That said, in the world of 1 hour rests, being able to get hp back in combat as a bonus action would be a nice feature, even if limited by hit dice.

I have to think the issue of 'spamming second wind' is addressed somehow in the rules or that it doesn't really end up being that big a deal. Either in the context of healing, the designers (presumably backed by playtest data) found that being able to bump your hp back up at one hour increments simply wasn't that powerful. Maybe when actually playing, most groups just didn't find value in stopping for that much of the day. Or maybe the default rules have you fully healed at the start of a new day anyway. Alternatively, perhaps, as others have mentioned, there is some limit on the number of short rests in a day-- unrelated to whether you had a fight.

I also would think this is the sort of thing they would address in the DMG when discussing different rules modules. So if you use 5 minute rests, a limit is placed on it. Or if you want grittier, slower healing it becomes temp hp.

At any rate, I'm curious to see how it plays out.

AD

 

[Cybit]

That doesn't really answer the question at all. Whether the length of the short rest is 5 minutes or 1 hour, the point is that if you rest for [double the length of a short rest], you get twice as much benefit if you're jumped by a goblin halfway through.



That makes it even weirder. Now you've got a situation where someone is all beat-up, gets jumped by a goblin, and suddenly feels better.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to have abilities that can only be used "in combat," or that are triggered/reset by going "into combat." I prefer a more fluid approach where combat and noncombat can seamlessly blend into each other.

Hrm, good points.

Though the amount of damage it heals in between fights once you get past...6th level is sort of inconsequential. You'd need 3+ hours of second wind in order to try to make up for an average fight.

If you were a 7th level fighter with 16 CON...you're healing 13 HP per hour, when your max HP is 67 on average. So...if you were hurt for half of your health (which is pretty common), it would take you three hours to rest it all back, assuming your DM lets you use it every hour (and is willing to interpret short rest rules in the favor of the PCs and ignore the part about "one or more hours". If you can rest three hours uninterrupted somewhere...you can probably rest 8 and just get it all back. It'll scale worse and worse as you level.

Not nearly as worried about it.