D&D 5E What's a wizard to do?

[Dausuul]

My impression is wizards are very strong... if you start as a fighter, or MC a cleric for armour.

For my money, you're better off with pure wizard. The occasional avoidance of a hit, for a non-melee class, is not worth delaying your access to higher-level spells, ability boosts, and class features. If AC is that important to you, play a mountain dwarf.

Speaking as a wizard player, the class has no shortage of power, but the "non-damage" approach is more challenging than it was in 3E. I have rarely found buffing spells to be worthwhile. Battlefield control and debuffs are solid, though; stinking cloud, sleep, suggestion, ​Otiluke's resilient sphere, and major image are all quite strong. At higher levels, you get some devastating options. I have seen a bard dominate a very difficult encounter with mass suggestion, and forcecage is better than it's ever been (since you no longer expend the material component on casting).

 

[Psikerlord#]

For my money, you're better off with pure wizard. The occasional avoidance of a hit, for a non-melee class, is not worth delaying your access to higher-level spells, ability boosts, and class features. If AC is that important to you, play a mountain dwarf.

Speaking as a wizard player, the class has no shortage of power, but the "non-damage" approach is more challenging than it was in 3E. I have rarely found buffing spells to be worthwhile. Battlefield control and debuffs are solid, though; stinking cloud, sleep, suggestion, ​Otiluke's resilient sphere, and major image are all quite strong. At higher levels, you get some devastating options. I have seen a bard dominate a very difficult encounter with mass suggestion, and forcecage is better than it's ever been (since you no longer expend the material component on casting).

I'll certainly defer to you if you've played a higher level caster

 

[WarHawke]

I tried the Cleric/Wizard combo, and frankly, I am not so ... sure about it. You fall one level behind, which means at level 3, I still had level 1 spells (granted I had level 2 spell slots). And sure I had medium armor and a shield, which was far far more superior to Mage Armor (and saves a valuable spell slot), I think I had an 18 AC..

And having the Cleric bonuses (which they make cleric far too easy to dip into in my opinion) was pretty cool. But, I felt like I was behind the power curve to the rest of the group. I feel that Heavy Armor is probably where the armor should be at if I want to be an armored mage, as I could hit an AC of 25 (with shield spell) very easily. And while Dex is not important to heavy armor's AC, it is important to Initiative. And then I have to raise my Strength up to 15.

The way the system is designed, if I take no feats and raise my stats with 2 points 5 times until level 19, I could have two stats at 20 by that time. Intelligence is one of them, obviously. But then you think about the feats that are out there. There are 2 or 3 feats that are WAY too good to pass up, especially for a caster and the others for anyone else. So now you are dropping 4 or 6 points of stat increases...

Most people will start at 16 for their primary stat... not power gaming, but just you show aptitude and you have 16 in that attribute. So two of your stat levels you pump up your casting stat to 20... because you want your spells to work and since To Hit bonus is based off of your primary casting stat... You need this number to be as high as possible.

The point of all this ? You could have heavy armor. Or you could have medium armor. But for mages... who really want armor and not wanting to be a dwarf... They would do best with Light/Medium and a shield. Because you can achieve what you need and keep your initiative bonus, at the cost of 1-3 AC.

But let's face it... Wizards... Stay in School. Dipping could be ok at level 20... because let's face it... the "capstone" ability for wizards... is just plain dumb LOL. But the level 18 one is extremely useful.

 

[dagger]

We play 1e and PF, but will be running a 5e in the near future. We have never had problems with the wizards outshining other classes, especially in 1e. Not sure why they went the way they did with wizards, but since I will be the DM its not my problem. I will let the wizard players worry about it.

 

[keterys]

My input is that the wizard out of the box is very very meh class. Almost pointless. Sorcerer and Warlock outshine the wizard in every way.

Ignoring versatility, this isn't my experience at all.

The warlock is dreadfully short rest beholden, and so far that's been a crippling weakness, so they're better at at-wills but not at actual spells.

The sorcerer has better spike potential on one target but generally has fewer spell slots and special effects that matter (ex: Diviner's portent, Evoker's AoE around allies, etc), so rapidly falls behind over the course of the day. It's closer, mind you.

But yeah, our general experience is that wizards are very good, but you need to select the correct spells. Don't Witch Bolt all over the place. But if you can't get Sleep to be effective at 1st and 2nd, you're probably cursed.

 

[WarHawke]

Ignoring versatility, this isn't my experience at all.

The warlock is dreadfully short rest beholden, and so far that's been a crippling weakness, so they're better at at-wills but not at actual spells.

The sorcerer has better spike potential on one target but generally has fewer spell slots and special effects that matter (ex: Diviner's portent, Evoker's AoE around allies, etc), so rapidly falls behind over the course of the day. It's closer, mind you.

But yeah, our general experience is that wizards are very good, but you need to select the correct spells. Don't Witch Bolt all over the place. But if you can't get Sleep to be effective at 1st and 2nd, you're probably cursed.

And just after my quote you quoted, I did say that Versatility happening much later and with resource costs. But fresh out of the box, the other casting classes have clear advantages.

 

[Thank Dog]

But let's face it... Wizards... Stay in School. Dipping could be ok at level 20... because let's face it... the "capstone" ability for wizards... is just plain dumb LOL. But the level 18 one is extremely useful.

Whilst it's not exceptionally powerful, it's not a dumb capstone at all. Being able to cast two extra 3rd level spells a day and having them be always prepared is a nice benefit. 3rd-level spells are where spells start to become very powerful. Fly, Haste, Counterspell, Dispel Magic, just to name a few are all excellent spells to have always prepared and to be able to cast once per day as a freebie.

 

[SilverfireSage]

Anyway, to respond to the OP: I hear ya. The classic strength of the wizard was versatility, as others have said. But it was also exclusivity: no other class had spells like Fireball, Lightning Bolt, Teleport, and Stone Shape. 106 cleric 216 wizard

That's no longer the case. The only primary caster class that doesn't have access to Fireball (through domain, patron, or magical secrets) is the Druid. Bard is now a primary caster (?!) and gets classic Wizard spells like Knock, Polymorph, Leomund's and Mordenkainen's, Teleport, even Power Word Kill. Druid has all the environmental control spells like Fog Cloud, Stone Shape, Wall spells, Ice Storm, and conjurations. Sorcerer of course has all the blast spells and enchantments. Clerics... oh geez, clerics.[/quote

Sure you can pick and choose fireball out of there. But while it's true that there are other "full" caster classes, none come even close to the wizard in number and versatility of spells. The cleric has 106 spells on their spell list, a respectable number, and the second most out of any class. However, the Wizards spell list has a whopping 216 spells on their spell list, over double that of a cleric. Sure, the cleric can get access to some of the staples like fireball if they pick the right subclass, but there are a ton of spells that they don't get. A light cleric's spells will be worthless against a fire elemental, but a wizard could have lightning bolt or cone of cold ready. None of the Mordenkinen spells are on the Cleric's list, as well as none of the illusion spells. They removed Miracle, so Wish is unique to the Sorcerer and the Wizard. Clone, Dominate Monster, Prismatic Spray, Teleport, Force Cage, Flesh to Stone, wall of force, telekinesis... I could go on. The Wizard is just as viable as it ever has been.

What does that leave the wizard? Ritual magic is AMAZING, but most primary classes get it and literally everyone (even the 8 Int half orc barbarian) can get it with a feat. The schools give interesting flavor (I really like the conjurer) but except for the diviner the effects aren't all that mechanically powerful.

That's one feat that could be used on a heck of a lot of different things, and I find that gaining any sort of class feature is just a feat away. Wizard has less hit points than the rest? Why not take Tough?

Reading your lament, I suggest you switch to a Light domain cleric. Blast away with Burning Hands, Scorching Ray, and Fireball. Use channel divinity to fry every enemy creature within 30'--and do this at least once per short rest. Turn or destroy undead. Use your reaction to give attackers disadvantage. Wear medium armor and a shield. Take the Magic Initiate feat to get access to Eldritch Blast (you do have a high Cha, right?). Now you can blast, you can battlefield control, you're well-protected. You may not be a god, but you're friends with one.

Remember that combat is only 1/3 of the game. There's no way a cleric is as useful when it comes to exploration and dungeon delving.