D&D 5E Light release schedule: More harm than good?

[Hussar]

How does that work? How does a light release schedule keep people interested in the game? Isn't it like saying that, had JK Rowling never released sequels to the original Harry Potter book, she could have kept people interested in that book and "giggle all the way to the bank"? Historically, RPG lines that are not supported fade away, they don't grow stronger.

JK Rowling only had to produce a book a year to become the highest paid author of all time. One book a year. That's it.

How many products do you have to release to keep people interested? I don't know. But, I'm guessing that WOTC is banking on the idea that two big releases per year (the adventure paths that they are banging out) will do the trick.

Note, "light release schedule" is not the same as releasing nothing at all. We've got the Elemental Princes AP coming in a month or two, along with a major rules update, and five or six months after that, we'll see another one IIRC. Even if someone didn't like the Tiamat AP, they might like the Elemental one, or the next one, or the one after that. How many supplements do you have to sell to keep people in the loop?

 

[Nellisir]

It's not self fulfilling. It's a recognition of reality. The core sells well. Every subsequent product sells less well. So, you have a choice, sell a whole lot of products with very slim margins until the whole house of cards collapses, just like it has done every single time with every single edition. Or, you bank on those core 3 sales, only sell a few products a year in order to keep people interested in those core three books, and giggle all the way to the bank.

Remember, the whole point of this is to break the edition churn cycle. Which is getting shorter and shorter every time. Three years per edition is far, far too much money spent in game development. By ever greening the core three, you can spread those profits over a much longer period. Heck, simply bank the money is probably a better ROI than continuously banging out new books in a losing race.

Basically what Mirrorball said just below your post here. If WotC only sells 3 products a year, and two years go by that I don't buy anything, that strengthens interest how?

Basically, I don't buy that WotC's designers are working on plushies, or video games, or board games. That's nonsensical. Working on ancillary products to drive interest to a product line that doesn't exist? What is a Waterdeep board game supposed to drive interest in, if there's no Forgotten Realms? It lacks any context. Also, I'm pretty sure that the game designers are game designers. Not programmers.

There are obvious spaces to be filled in the existing core. I've mentioned them. I think we'll see them. But the amount of support 5e has received since the DMG came out has been...what? 12 pages of Eberron material and a Sage Advice article that doesn't answer any questions? That concerns me. There's no anticipation that I've noticed for the Princes of the Apocalypse adventure, and nothing else to be interested in. It's one thing to expect declining sales after the core 3; quite another to write off the sales in advance.

 

[Nellisir]

JK Rowling only had to produce a book a year to become the highest paid author of all time. One book a year. That's it.

One book, per year, in a series, that was consistently well done. The adventures aren't series. They're one-and-done campaigns. There's no lead from one to another. And the first one has not been overwhelmingly well received.

How many products do you have to release to keep people interested? I don't know. But, I'm guessing that WOTC is banking on the idea that two big releases per year (the adventure paths that they are banging out) will do the trick.

An adventure is a type of RP product. Basically, you're guessing that WotC is going to rest the D&D line on a single product type, and one that's historically been a weak seller. That they've gone from 3e & the hopes that the 3rd-party market would provide adventures, to 5e and releasing nothing but adventures.

Note, "light release schedule" is not the same as releasing nothing at all. We've got the Elemental Princes AP coming in a month or two, along with a major rules update, and five or six months after that, we'll see another one IIRC. Even if someone didn't like the Tiamat AP, they might like the Elemental one, or the next one, or the one after that. How many supplements do you have to sell to keep people in the loop?

Those aren't supplements. Those are adventures.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Even if someone didn't like the Tiamat AP, they might like the Elemental one, or the next one, or the one after that. How many supplements do you have to sell to keep people in the loop?

I don't know. What if they don't buy adventures?

 

[Kramodlog]

Seriously?

No. It was me being pedantic.

THAT'S your response? 30+ products out there in under the first year of release, and you're complaining because not 100% of them are player specific? Really?

The problem with the list is that I do not buy adventures. I do not need the basic set or the basic rules. I do not like figurines, especially boxes filled with random figurines. So basically, all that there is interesting on the list are the core books. It is a pretty weak first year release. I'm not the only one who seems to think this.

Just people rambling on the internet? Yup. But this argument was also used on people who were critical of 4e. Seems time validated those ramblers. Who knows what time will tell us this time?

 

[weldon]

There are obvious spaces to be filled in the existing core. I've mentioned them. I think we'll see them. But the amount of support 5e has received since the DMG came out has been...what? 12 pages of Eberron material and a Sage Advice article that doesn't answer any questions? That concerns me.

I don't disagree with much in what you've written, but this part confuses me. What kind of "support" were you expecting in the two months since the DMG was released? If it's not an adventure (as your other posts indicate) what were you expecting?

 

[Jester David]

Basically what Mirrorball said just below your post here. If WotC only sells 3 products a year, and two years go by that I don't buy anything, that strengthens interest how?

Basically, I don't buy that WotC's designers are working on plushies, or video games, or board games. That's nonsensical. Working on ancillary products to drive interest to a product line that doesn't exist? What is a Waterdeep board game supposed to drive interest in, if there's no Forgotten Realms? It lacks any context. Also, I'm pretty sure that the game designers are game designers. Not programmers.

There are obvious spaces to be filled in the existing core. I've mentioned them. I think we'll see them. But the amount of support 5e has received since the DMG came out has been...what? 12 pages of Eberron material and a Sage Advice article that doesn't answer any questions? That concerns me. There's no anticipation that I've noticed for the Princes of the Apocalypse adventure, and nothing else to be interested in. It's one thing to expect declining sales after the core 3; quite another to write off the sales in advance.

Here's the hard truth: Wizards of the Coast doesn't expect you to buy everything. But they're also not making products just for you.

This is the catch. For the last two editions, all the D&D eggs have been in a single basket. All D&D products were really focused on a single audience: the RPG players. So the game lived or died based on how that one audience wanted to spend their money. And if that audience felt stretched thin, then sales would drop. If that one audience felt they had enough product, then sales would drop. If another game or product came out that prioritized that audience's funds, then sales would drop.

Now the D&D is being spread out. WotC is focusing on spreading out to to board gamers, video gamers, miniature war gamers, comic fans, and yes the RPG fans. So they can pull in the same revenue as monthly books but target different audiences, potentially increasing total profits.
And WotC can do so while licencing out products, keeping their own staffing and overhead costs low. Because WotC is all about maximizing profits.

This does mean fewer RPG products, but it should mean its significantly easier to afford said products as there's less cutting into the ol' wallet. And the rarer products are more exciting, since they're less common and everyday. Which might translate to higher and more sustained sales.

It's a little like going from a spoiled only child to having a couple siblings. Suddenly you have to share and not everything can be about you.

And, hopefully, with fewer books they won't need to reboot or relaunch the game after 2-4 years.

 

[Hussar]

Basically what Mirrorball said just below your post here. If WotC only sells 3 products a year, and two years go by that I don't buy anything, that strengthens interest how?

Basically, I don't buy that WotC's designers are working on plushies, or video games, or board games. That's nonsensical. Working on ancillary products to drive interest to a product line that doesn't exist? What is a Waterdeep board game supposed to drive interest in, if there's no Forgotten Realms? It lacks any context. Also, I'm pretty sure that the game designers are game designers. Not programmers.

There are obvious spaces to be filled in the existing core. I've mentioned them. I think we'll see them. But the amount of support 5e has received since the DMG came out has been...what? 12 pages of Eberron material and a Sage Advice article that doesn't answer any questions? That concerns me. There's no anticipation that I've noticed for the Princes of the Apocalypse adventure, and nothing else to be interested in. It's one thing to expect declining sales after the core 3; quite another to write off the sales in advance.

You're missing the point though Nellisir. If producing the material that would interest you is a losing proposition for WOTC, then why would they do it? They've flat out stated, in no uncertain terms, that we are not going to see splats. You are not going to get a 5e version of the Complete Fighter or whatever. It's not going to happen. The stated reason for this not happening is because producing those splats leads to edition churn.

Now, you can disagree with the reasoning, that's fine, but, that's the reason that's being given. So, no, you're not going to see those spaces filled in by books. It's not going to happen. Because filling in those spaces just means we'll have 6e that much faster.

No anticipation for Princes of the Apocalypse? Really? It's already ranking on Amazon and it's not out for almost two months yet.

Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #4,914 in Books (See Top 100 in Books)
#8 in Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Gaming > Dungeons & Dragons
#46 in Books > Humor & Entertainment > Puzzles & Games

How popular does it have to be? I mean that Pathfinder Core Book is #3595 in Books, and that's the highest ranking Pathfinder product. Again, how popular does something have to be? When a product is still on pre-order and it's more popular than the best selling book of your competition, I gotta think that's not a bad thing.

 

[BryonD]

I gotta think that's not a bad thing.

Funny. It seems we have been down this "things are going good now, so what could possibly go wrong later?" road before.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Because filling in those spaces just means we'll have 6e that much faster.

That's the hypothesis that's being tested. I guess we'll see in a couple of years if it worked.