D&D 5E (2014) Perception vs Investigation

[pukunui]

Do it the way you think is best and suits your table.

Oh, I intend to! It was particularly irksome with LMoP, since that was aimed at new DMs, yet it was giving them conflicting advice on how to adjudicate those checks.

 

[Sunseeker]

I was under the impression that perception was used when you were looking for something, and investigation was used in conversation.

 

[pukunui]

I was under the impression that perception was used when you were looking for something, and investigation was used in conversation.

I'm not sure where you got that idea from. I haven't seen anything that would suggest Investigation is a social skill. That's what Intimidation, Insight, Persuasion and Deception are for.

 

[MerricB]

I was under the impression that perception was used when you were looking for something, and investigation was used in conversation.

Nope. You might want to take a look at page 178 of the PHB, and page 121 of the DMG. It will be clearer, but still not clear!

 

[Lidgar]

This has been a subject of discussion at our gaming table.

Nope. You might want to take a look at page 178 of the PHB, and page 121 of the DMG. It will be clearer, but still not clear!

Page 121 of the DMG really helped clear it up for us.

A successful Perception check lets you find something (including detecting traps).

"A character actively looking for for a trap can attempt a Wisdom (Perception) check against the trap's DC."

A successful Investigation check allows you to disarm the trap.

Note that for magical traps, an Intelligence (Arcana) check will allow a character to detect and/or disarm the trap.

My sense is that the designers wanted to keep Perception and Investigation somewhat interchangeable/vague to allow for DM's to judge what would be best.

 

[pukunui]

My sense is that the designers wanted to keep Perception and Investigation somewhat interchangeable/vague to allow for DM's to judge what would be best.

If only they'd do that in their official adventures, too, rather than be totally inconsistent about it.

 

[HobbitFan]

You guys raise a good point. I had no idea the use of the two skills in the modules has been so all over the place.

 

[iserith]

I was under the impression that perception was used when you were looking for something, and investigation was used in conversation.

Sure, investigation could be applied if you're trying to deduce something based on clues obtained during a conversation when the outcome of the deduction is uncertain. But that's just one situation where Investigation might be used to resolve uncertainty.

 

[Tony Vargas]

At first glance, perception/investigation looked like the spot/search dichotomy in 3e.

The former is alertness and awareness of what's significant among the things you happen to see, the latter is close examination and analysis. They could almost be the same proficiency with spot/listen/perception being passive & wisdom based and search/investigation being active & int-based.

 

[Fralex]

Yeah, the difference between Perception and Investigation is kinda confusing. If it helps, keep in mind that animals can have a very good Perception bonus but rarely are good at Investigation. That's because Perception is more about how good your senses are; it makes you aware of things. Investigation is about how well you process what you perceive; it makes you recognize things. Investigation has intent. You always know what you're trying to find.

The problem I have with it is the concept of just using "investigation" on something is really nebulous. All the other Intelligence skills are based around knowledge about a particular topic. What sort of knowledge does Investigation use? The knowledge of... what clues mean? ...how to find clues? These all seem like things that would be better-suited to a specific knowledge check. I'd rather replace it with another one of those, maybe 3.5e's Architecture & Engineering check. Then you could break it down like this:
Arcana: Finding magical lore, identifying a magical device or effect based on clues
Architecture & Engineering: Finding hidden doors, identifying man-made traps, locating a structure's weak point
History: Identifying what civilization an artifact came from, figuring out why something was created
Nature: Identifying natural hazards, deducing whether or not something is poisonous, investigating a dead person's cause of death or time of death
Religion: Identifying the god a temple was built for, working out what ritual was performed based on things left over
Generic Intelligence checks: Any other kind of investigation