If a player wants his stuff to be mundane that bad I would hope a DM could/would work with him...
I'd hope so, too. And you know what makes that a lot easier on both player and DM: a nice, non-supernatural class that covers a big swath of such archetypes that the extant 4-5 (out of 38) non-supernatural sub-classes just can't do justice to.
You know what else the ability of players to work with eachother & the DM, and the DM to make rulings means: if you don't like that class, you can change it or not use it.
Again, the same argument that implies "it's OK to substitute a completely inappropriate class for what you actually want, because DM Empowerment" also implies just as strongly "It's OK to add a perfectly good class, because DM Empowerment."
DM Empowerment is wonderful. It saved 5e for me. I love it. But it doesn't mean the game can't benefit from some good rules, including a class to cover concepts the game currently can't do or can't do /well/, and it also doesn't mean you have to use every rule that comes down the line, no matter how awesome others may find it.
Second wouldn't the DM have to be on-board to allow this hypothetical optional class? What's the difference?
The difference between: "Can I play optional class W from supplement M?" "Yes."
And:
[sblock="sense of humor required"]
"Can I play a character who's kinda like a bard but not really, and kinda like a Battlemaster but not really, but more a hybrid but not multiclassed per se, and who does some of the cool stuff bards can do but without magic, and three of the not-that-cool things the battlemaster can do but a little better, and some other things neither the bard nor the battlemaster can do, and still without magic?" "I guess so." "Cool! Uh, were do we start?" "Concept, of course, what exactly is this thing you have in mind?" "Well, I want a character whose very knowledgeable, thus Bard, but who is from a martial tradition, like the Battlemaster, so really, Valor Bard is close, but it's a wholly-martial tradition, no magic. The idea is he helps the rest of the party with his knowledge of enemies, military tactics, special training if they know what their up against next, things like that." "Like a Drill Seargant?" "More like a martial-arts guru, but without the mumbo-jumbo." "So you, like, give advice a lot?" "Yeah!, like 'shoot the antennae, they're helpless without them!'" "Wow, 'Them,' really, you know that movie?" "It's a classic of atom-age horror, I mean, like /the/ classic!" "OK, OK, so you want to play the little old entomologist from 'Them' - " "No, of course not, it's a fantasy concept, a martial tradition, uses different weapons for different missions, but, yeah, knows all about monsters and how to defeat them." "Maybe a ranger, y'know, Favored Enemy" "Rangers don't have that anymore." "Oh, yeah, right." "And more general than that anyway, unless you want to run a game where we're fighting the same things all the time." "Not so much, no." "So, I was thinking, we could re-skin each spell to be a point of knowledge or a tactical ploy or maneuver or something." "Well, let's just start with the 1st level spells...." "Or Cantrips." "OK, yeah, or, actually, first we have to cover how spells work, in general. Because, you know, if you're non-magical, then for the purposes of any spell or abilty that specifcally disrupts magic, yoru abilities are not affected. Right?" "Well, yeah, not being magical." "But that's a distinct advantage isn't it, you can't be dispelled or counter-spelled..." "When was the last time you had an NPC caster actually counterspell someone?" "I might do, I like the 5e counterspell better than the 3.5 version." "Well, OK, so there's this trivial theoretical-" "
obvious advantage." "OK, so what to do we do?" "Well, all of his abilities longer than Instantaneous coudl require concentration and are subject to those rules." "Whoa, everyone's been bitching about concentration being a big nerf." "Well you gotta lose something." "But, not all spells are non-instantaneous, and what about the ones that are already concentration, that doesn't work, you're penalizing some spells more than others." "Yeah, well, I could come up with a double-dog-concentration or something..." "C'mon, this is just supposed to be re-skinning." "'Not magic' changes things, though." "Besides, concentration is silly, why would he concentrate on advice he's just given them, will they forget to 'shoot the antennae' because he's not staring intently at them?" "You're really not helping your case with that reference. What spell is supposed to model 'advice' anyway." "Well Guidance y'know, and stuff like it..." "Like?" "Anything with a similar mechanic." "Like....?" "Well Bless, obvoiusly, b- " "You know Bless is OP and you want to cast it un-dispell, er, without concentration in a way that can't be countered or dispelled?" "No, that only just now occurred to me." "Uh-huh." "I was really thinking more Guidance, but without the concentration... oh, hey, how 'bout we take Bless off the list?" "Yeah? OK, that'd work, that's like the spell that was making SharpShooter so broken in the last game." "Cool." "No, wait, let's look through the rest of the Bard list...."...hours later... "OK, so this list of spells is getting re-skinned, and this other list you're giving up." "Yeah, that'll work." "OK, now, about casting them. Spells require components." "Sure, verbal components, I shout information and instructions to people." "Well, and gestures and materials" "Couldn't we just hand-wave the gestures?" *laugh track plays* "No, you need to have a hand free, and you'll need to use comparable material components" "I'm not casting spells, why should I need material components." "Because if you don't that's another 'advantage' you have to 'pay for' - look, you could have focus (same price as an arcane focus) it could a sack of medicines, herbal boosters, tactical manuals, etc." "No, wait, I'm a tactical genius, not a doctor, dammit" *laugh track plays* "I was just going to use Healing Word for Majestic Word for Inspiring Word." "If you're so knowledgeable you can do first aid, Cure Wounds could be first aid." "Hey, can I drop Cure Wounds from the list and not be an unlicensed pharmacist?" "OK fine." "OK, and then, of course pay the price for any expensive above and beyond components which would be chalked up as the necessary ingredients, poultices, healing salves," "Still not a doctor." "Whatever, tomes, etc. you need beyond those in your bag of tricks.... " "Nor a magician." "Just live with it, OK, it's not like anyone tracks components, you just have to have the hand free, and they might be taken away from you." "How 'bout a focus then?" "What you have pointer and powerpoint presentation?" "Or a battle standard or something, to like wave and point for signaling." "Hey, as long as it's a thing, and you can't do material component spells without it, I don't care." "Now, back the spell list, we'll start with re-skinning the cantrips...." ...more time passes... "OK, now, we wanted some battlemaster maneuvers, too?" "Yeah, like Commander's Strike and well, I don't need Rally, but I think there's one or two others." "I don't think you should get CS dice, you already have spells" "not Spells" "Yeah, sure." "Re-skinning isn't going to work if everyone just calls them spells." "Right, we'll have crib notes, don't worry about it." "Maneuvers, strategems, tactics..." "Got, so you already have those and ...slots..." "sure" "..slots to meter use of them - do we need to go into why you can only..." "No, no, I'd like to actually play the character at some point. Just, some tricks don't always work, so when I really want them to, I use a 'slot'" *offscreen* "Hey! Guys! Did I just hear a disassociated mechanic? I did, didn't I, whatheckdoyoubastardsthinkyouredoingtryingtodestroyD&D-" "Woah! Cool it, we're not doing that." "Better not. I'm watching you!" *does the pointing at his eyes and back at them bit, though he's off-screen so you can't see him, but you know he's doing it* "Sheesh." "It's your game, you don't have to-" "I don't /want/ to listen to that rant again." "So what are slots then?" "Your idea, you tell me" "er... what are slots to begin with, anyway?" "well there, y'know, you don't memorize spells anymore but you still have the slots they used to go in, and instead you... I guess I hadn't really thought about it." ...more hours later... "OK, I think that'll do for now." "Yeah, I should really let someone else build their character." "Oh, ours are done, we've just been re-watching Heroes in the next room." "Yeah, it's even lamer than I remember." "Hey, in the corner with the cell phone!" "Oh, sorry 1 minute." "Is your character ready?" "I meant to ask about that, but, just a couple minutes, OK." "fine..." "Wow, they got married, that is so trite." "What?" "I was reading War & Peace on project Gutenberg while you were building that character, the ending was kinda lame." "Ooookay. About your character." "Oh, yeah, I'm glad you asked, so I was thinking something like a Great-Old-One Warlock, mainly for the telepathy, but casting more like a Sorcerer, or maybe a Spell-Point-variant wizard, but not magical...."
[/sblock]It's just a lot easier to pull an option out of the DMG or UA or a supplement, then to engage in extensive negotiation and/or game design at every table where it comes up.
OK, I'm done for now, I have to see an oral surgeon about getting my tongue removed from my cheek....
