D&D General why do we not have an arcane half caster?

[Frozen_Heart]

Consolidating good points and things I've noticed recurring, as well as my own thoughts:

Lore...

• Class Name? (Swordmage? Magus?)
• Class Story? (Monster hunter/Binder? Planar Defender? Magic Enforcer? Dangerous Artefact/Lore stewardship? Magic given artificially?)
• Subclasses? (Wizard school based? More sorcerer focus? Focus on specific planes or enemies? Blood/Death Knights?)

Mechanics...

• Half Caster
• Spellstrike/Spell list built around magic combat
• Arcane Theme, without divine or primal RP baggage.

Edit: Added the point from tempest about maybe their magic could be given artificially?

 

[Mind of tempest]

Consolidating good points and things I've noticed recurring, as well as my own thoughts:

Lore...

• Class Name? (Swordmage? Magus?)
• Class Story? (Monster hunter/Binder? Planar Defender? Magic Enforcer? Dangerous Artefact/Lore stewardship?)
• Subclasses? (Wizard school based? More sorcerer focus? Focus on specific planes or enemies? Blood/Death Knights?)

Mechanics...

• Half Caster
• Spellstrike/Spell list built around magic combat
• Arcane Theme, without divine or primal RP baggage.

that they get magic artificially by it being induced was one idea.

 

[jmartkdr2]

Consolidating good points and things I've noticed recurring, as well as my own thoughts:

Lore...

• Class Name? (Swordmage? Magus?)
• Class Story? (Monster hunter/Binder? Planar Defender? Magic Enforcer? Dangerous Artefact/Lore stewardship?)
• Subclasses? (Wizard school based? More sorcerer focus? Focus on specific planes or enemies? Blood/Death Knights?)

Mechanics...

• Half Caster
• Spellstrike/Spell list built around magic combat
• Arcane Theme, without divine or primal RP baggage.

Trying to tie up the second bullet point: they're all trained (built) for a specific task, but able to use those skill in other contexts.

I do like the idea of the magic power being imposed into them, as it's basically the opposite of a paladin. They didn't dedicate themselves, they were dedicated by someone else.

This would push the subclasses to be about the task (broadly) they were made/trained/empowered to do, which means a lot of the playstyle variations need to come from other features. (ie spells)

 

[Michael Linke]

They said above that they don't consider Paladin or Ranger to be half casters because they use a different spell list than their "parent" class, and thus aren't "half" of anything. I feel like it's a willful misuse of the standard jargon, so I didn't feel like engaging with it.

Casting half as many spells doesn't mean anything when you're casting different spells. 3 oranges isn't half of 6 apples. But, even if you disagree that the Eldritch Knight is the only half-caster, can't we agree it's a half-caster? And prominently featured right there in the main PHB?

 

[TwoSix]

Casting half as many spells doesn't mean anything when you're casting different spells. 3 oranges isn't half of 6 apples. But, even if you disagree that the Eldritch Knight is the only half-caster, can't we agree it's a half-caster? And prominently featured right there in the main PHB?

In general 5e jargon, Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster are third-casters. They gain 1 new spell level progression every 3 class levels.

 

[Asisreo]

I'm fiddling with the idea of a Blood Mage character that has d12 HD, Con and Int saves, and spellcasting using "blood points" which are effectively spell points at the rate of half casters.

They can sacrifice their maximum HP (including current HP) to replenish blood points, so 2 of their max HP is equal to a 1st level spell slot.

Their actual design goal is to be a debuffer/controller character. They get features like bypassing certain condition immunities, disadvantage on Constitution saves, and automatically succeed Concentration checks (high level).

They get subclasses at level 2 and Extra Attack at level 5. Simple weapon and light armor proficiency.

 

[Mind of tempest]

Trying to tie up the second bullet point: they're all trained (built) for a specific task, but able to use those skill in other contexts.

I do like the idea of the magic power being imposed into them, as it's basically the opposite of a paladin. They didn't dedicate themselves, they were dedicated by someone else.

This would push the subclasses to be about the task (broadly) they were made/trained/empowered to do, which means a lot of the playstyle variations need to come from other features. (ie spells)

but make new spells is fun and interesting.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

If you had full read all of my posts on the subject, you would have seen I had already commented on this. That the Core Four are the only ones that have been allowed to be somewhat "generic". The other eight classes that have now shown up in more than one edition are all covered in fluff and story. And there hasn't been an arcane half-caster class whose story has sunk into the D&D populace headspace to warrant a place in the base game.

why haven't we seen an arcane half-caster remain in the game

The Swordmage gained plenty of traction. That’s why the EK and arguably the Hexblade are in the game. It didn’t remain in the game because wotc didn’t want to put a “4e class” in the PHB, and tried to make the EK and AT fit the bill, which they don’t. Since they’re in the same conceptual space, as are a handful of other subclasses they’ve put out since then, it is now harder to imagine a wotc base class for the concept, but it would have been easy for them to do it in the phb, and they still could put it in, they’d just have to work harder because subclasses ate a lot of its cool toys.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Trying to tie up the second bullet point: they're all trained (built) for a specific task, but able to use those skill in other contexts.

I do like the idea of the magic power being imposed into them, as it's basically the opposite of a paladin. They didn't dedicate themselves, they were dedicated by someone else.

This would push the subclasses to be about the task (broadly) they were made/trained/empowered to do, which means a lot of the playstyle variations need to come from other features. (ie spells)

This concept may be a better source for class and archetype names. A name that describes what the class is will probably be more emotive than what they do.

 

[DEFCON 1]

The Swordmage gained plenty of traction. That’s why the EK and arguably the Hexblade are in the game. It didn’t remain in the game because wotc didn’t want to put a “4e class” in the PHB, and tried to make the EK and AT fit the bill, which they don’t. Since they’re in the same conceptual space, as are a handful of other subclasses they’ve put out since then, it is now harder to imagine a wotc base class for the concept, but it would have been easy for them to do it in the phb, and they still could put it in, they’d just have to work harder because subclasses ate a lot of its cool toys.

Hexblade's in the game because they determined their Warlock's 'Pact of the Blade' wasn't good enough apparently, so they combed through old 3E content and brought this class forward into a subclass (and even then they made sure to add story and fluff of the patron being a sentient weapon of some type, usually from the Raven Queen.) And the EK is in the game because it was an arcane warrior whose story was no different than the Swordmage. After all... here is what the 4E Forgotten Realms Player's Guide said a Swordmage was in their opening paragraphs of the class write-up:

Swordmages apply the arcane arts to melee combat. The combat skills they possess are enhanced by the magic they wield. The flourish of a swordmage’s blade not only bites with steel, but also with fire, lightning, or other powerful forces. You studied and practiced for years to master your skills. You mastered the fundamentals of arcane magic and combined this academic study with endless hours of physical training. You might be a young eladrin in search of your fortune, a stranger to the wider world outside the seclusion of your homeland; a self-trained genasi sellsword, gifted with an affinity for elemental magic; the scion of a disgraced noble human family, taught by the finest tutors in youth but now a footloose expatriate; or a half-elf arcane champion, rigorously trained in a war magic academy to serve in the armies of your homeland. Magical barriers of force swirl around you, protecting you from harm. The blade you carry is an extension of your being, both body and mind. It pulses with eldritch energy as you prepare to defend your allies and unleash magical fury against your foes.

The story of this class is "you add arcane magic to your melee combat". That's it. This brand new class added to D&D and this was the extent of it. That's all their fluff is. A warrior who casts wizard spells. Which is the exact same story the Eldritch Knight has. So why does the Swordmage need to be a full class? The only reason people give is because they want special game mechanics to exist for this class... which is never the sole reason why a new class would get made. Heck... the designers have gone out of their way NOT to find reasons to create an entire Psion class for the simple reason they don't see enough of a story reason for it beyond what they already gave with their 3 subclasses. And heck they tried to squeeze the Artificer into the Wizard at one point so they wouldn't have to make a new class just for engineering and magic item creation. But at least the Artificer has enough story and legs to justify 3 to 4 different "engineering" types of subclasses that could come out of it so they finally gave in.

As we've said above... if anyone can't give an in-world job or reason for the existence of a specialized class of arcane warrior that is necessary above and beyond the Pact of the Blade Warlock, the Hexblade Warlock, the Bladesinger Wizard, the Eldritch Knight Fighter, and the College of Sword Bard... the class will not get made by WotC to appear in an eventual book. Now you all can create all manner of your own versions (just like the Warlord has been attempted again and again and again)... but that's going to have to suffice. Because WotC has shown over all these years that they just don't see the necessity of making one themselves.