TSR Running list of potential problematic issues in TSR era DnD

[ShinHakkaider]

Thanks for implying I am a racist when my approach is actually scholarly and ignoring that I point out the way to progressivism is not to point fingers back but to point them forward with an open hand of embrace because when you point at things you still have three fingers pointing back at you. Before lumping people you do not know into the racist/conservative/etc cart you should analyze yourself for that purity you are looking for.

Nah, that's not what you were doing and you know it, but keep telling yourself that you're being "scholarly".
You look to and examine the past in order not to (hopefully) repeat those mistakes in the future. I push back against and am VERY leery of anyone who says "don't point fingers at the past". It's another way of nullifying and ignoring peoples past experiences, it leads to gaslighting those same people when it comes to racism, sexism, whatever. Looking forward is MEANINGLESS when you still have the unaddressed spectre of the past ever looming.

Anyone that I've EVER dealt with whether online or in person who has taken that approach and then hidden under the shield of being "scholarly" or "objective" has been a bad faith actor and or worse (whether they acknowledge it or not).

 

[Weiley31]

At the very least, it's probably because it's now considered poor taste to refer to the Romani people as such.

Hence why I mentioned it in this topic since it has such a negative connotation and it came about during the TSR era.

 

[Weiley31]

HIT DOG

How do you know he's a dog that takes contracts for hire?

 

[reelo]

Exactly. That’s the point. There are many different African cultures, and NONE of them are being represented. We took a black man and put him in European style armor and dress.

Yes, but "European style" is just as much a pastiche, in D&D. Norman knights, and Hungarian boyars, and Spanish conquistadores, and Teutonic crusaders, and Polish hussars, and Pictish warriors, are all "European", yet nobody bats an eye when they get lumped together as "vanilla D&D" style.

Anyway, I'm completely on board with getting non-European cultures represented in gaming, but if "European" is good enough a category to lump everything together, so should "Asian" or "African" or "South-American".

 

[ShinHakkaider]

How do you know he's a dog that takes contracts for hire?

Wait...that wasnt common knowledge? UH OH.

Also? I deleted HIT DOG WILL HOLLER thing because its a colloquialism I didn't think people would get it..

 

[Weiley31]

Weird fun fact: The Cheesecake/Bikini Armor got somewhat of a technical term, IIRC, in the Book of Erotic Fantasy, by being referred to as Glory Armor.

 

[Gradine]

There needs to be an eyeroll react so I can like that post

 

[Gradine]

Yep. I thought my first post was pretty clear on what the context of this thread is. Apparently a lot of folks either won't read that, or choose to be disingenuous and ignore what I wrote to argue strawmen. Recreating a thread with a + won't change that.

Yeah, it's a pity. Best to ignore, really. There's no room in this thread to argue over the merits of the thread or its purpose.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Yes, but "European style" is just as much a pastiche, in D&D. Norman knights, and Hungarian boyars, and Spanish conquistadores, and Teutonic crusaders, and Polish hussars, and Pictish warriors, are all "European", yet nobody bats an eye when they get lumped together as "vanilla D&D" style.

Anyway, I'm completely on board with getting non-European cultures represented in gaming, but if "European" is good enough a category to lump everything together, so should "Asian" or "African" or "South-American".

I think you're missing the point. Let me try to rephrase.

Yes, European culture has many cultures within it, as you list. Most of them have been represented in D&D artwork a ton. There are many individual cultures in Africa. Almost none of them were represented.

See the problem? It's not about lumping in several European cultures into one, or several African cultures into one. It's about depicting mostly only European culture and excluding all others.

 

[reelo]

I think you're missing the point. Let me try to rephrase.

Yes, European culture has many cultures within it, as you list. Most of them have been represented in D&D artwork a ton. There are many individual cultures in Africa. Almost none of them were represented.

See the problem? It's not about lumping in several European cultures into one, or several African cultures into one. It's about depicting mostly only European culture and excluding all others.

No, I completely get that, rest assured!

As I said, I am FOR more representation of different cultures, but I fear that (as seen with OA in the past) there will be criticism of "pastiche", while disregarding the fact that ALL of D&D is pastiche.