D&D 5E In defense of my post....

[Helldritch]

And the warning on the Book of Vile Darkness was quite needed. Although I don't use the safety tools per say, I do make a point of knowing where my players stand on certain subject and learn about their tolerance to certain sensitive subjects.

The only campaign I did with that book was a harsh one and though they liked the campaign, we did not continue with that line of playing. We much prefer heroic campaign. Grim dark yes, but heroic nonetheless.

 

[ourmaninboston]

Safety tools are not censorship, even by the broadest possible use of the term. They also do not limit expression in any way; they are tools that one can use to get a sense of what the other people in one’s group are comfortable with, what they might be somewhat uncomfortable with but are willing to push their comfort zone for, and what their dealbreakers are. If something like that doesn’t seem useful for you and your group of players, you don’t have to use them, but other people who use them cause absolutely no harm to you whatsoever by doing so. Your concerns that such tools are censoring or limiting expression in any way are woefully misplaced.

I was referring very specifically to mandatory surveys telling everyone at my table what they're not allowed to discuss. Again, I think pre-emptively silencing people at my table is awkward, unnecessary, restrictive, actively HAMPERS social progress and is, frankly, unhealthy. My players have complete agency; they can and do speak up at any time they wish.

I wouldn't dare presume to tell other people how to run their games; nor do I want other people telling me or my players how to run ours. The point of my original post.

 

[ourmaninboston]

Yes, what safety tools are is a means for players to ensure they will enjoy your content.

When I ran a Call of Cthulhu campaign, I cautioned my players to expect evil cults, dark rituals and violence, but not sexual violence. One of my players was very religious, and although he was fine with it, he might as well have not been fine with it. That is not something you want to run into mid-play. Safety tools avoid such an unpleasant situation.

Just imagine if your campaign contains some sort of dark sexual ritual, and a player relives a real life personal trauma because of it. No creator wants that, right? That doesn't mean you need to censor your campaign, but warn players of the content before they play it.

Heck, even the third edition Book of Vile Darkness had a content warning.

Content warnings, fair enough.

I think the whole POINT of roleplaying is catharsis though; reliving trauma among trusted confidantes is the way one heals. It's a means of achieving closure.

 

[ourmaninboston]

And the warning on the Book of Vile Darkness was quite needed. Although I don't use the safety tools per say, I do make a point of knowing where my players stand on certain subject and learn about their tolerance to certain sensitive subjects.

The only campaign I did with that book was a harsh one and though they liked the campaign, we did not continue with that line of playing. We much prefer heroic campaign. Grim dark yes, but heroic nonetheless.

well, one assumes that an adult DM is going to be evolved enough to not deliberately make his or her players uncomfortable. But being told "your group is not allowed to talk about this, this, this and this" makes me pretty much reflexively want to raise a middle finger and say "Oh yeah? Stop me!"

 

[Helldritch]

well, one assumes that an adult DM is going to be evolved enough to not deliberately make his or her players uncomfortable. But being told "your group is not allowed to talk about this, this, this and this" makes me pretty much reflexively want to raise a middle finger and say "Oh yeah? Stop me!"

Ishhhh.... Not the kind of thing that would do. No one tells me what to do or how to run things at my table but it is a simple question of mutual respect to not go where people are nor feeling OK with.

Now if an outsider isn't happy on how I run my table or the subjects we deal with. It is an other matter entirely. But I respect my players and they respect me enough to be aware of what would pass or not pass at my table. And for the stranger, I would have a conversation first, and if no agreement can be reached, the door can be used to get out too.

 

[Uni-the-Unicorn!]

I have seen that on other products--Heroes of Baldur's Gate, for instance:

Heroes of Baldur's Gate (5e) - Dungeon Masters Guild | Dungeon Masters Guild

Heroes of Baldur's Gate (5e) - From James Ohlen, the lead designer of Baldur's Gate I & II... Sinister forces are moving against the city of Bald

www.dmsguild.com

While their using it isn't proof that it's okay, that was a fairly high-profile product, so the fact that WotC didn't make them change it seems to point that way.

That is a DMsGuild product. You can use WotC IP and trade dress on a DMsGuild product.

You can’t publish Kickstarters on DMsGuild, so this project doesn’t qualify.

 

[Morrus]

I wouldn't dare presume to tell other people how to run their games; nor do I want other people telling me or my players how to run ours. The point of my original post.

I think you're confused.

Safety tools (such as a Session 0) don't involve an external regulatory agency coming in and telling you how to run your game.

They involve you and your players deciding between yourselves how you as a group want to play your game.

Nobody is telling anybody to do anything.

 

[Bird Of Play]

Yeah same here and even if it was the most glorious must-have materials I've ever seen you wouldn't get a penny from me now.

EDIT TO ADD:
Not only that, but your perspective on what D&D is and is not in these modern times is very askew of my perspective.
I won't support someone who makes comments like

D&D 5E - WotC's Jeremy Crawford on D&D Races Going Forward

On Twitter, Jeremy Crawford discussed the treatment of orcs, Vistani, drow and others in D&D, and how WotC plans to treat the idea of 'race' in D&D going forward. In recent products (Eberron and Wildemount), the mandatory evil alignment was dropped from orcs, as was the Intelligence penalty...

www.enworld.org

and

D&D 5E - WotC's Jeremy Crawford on D&D Races Going Forward

On Twitter, Jeremy Crawford discussed the treatment of orcs, Vistani, drow and others in D&D, and how WotC plans to treat the idea of 'race' in D&D going forward. In recent products (Eberron and Wildemount), the mandatory evil alignment was dropped from orcs, as was the Intelligence penalty...

www.enworld.org

You're either outdated or a troll, either way not worthy of my backing.

Oooooh juicy comment, this makes me want to open a discussion on the concept of race in D&D and similar fantasy sci-fi settings. Personally, I love me some racism and sexism in my campaigns. It's like, you know, your players fight against those things. Which is cool.

I'd love to open a thread, but I wonder 1) if the mods allow it; 2) if the subject hasn't already been beaten to death here.

EDIT: wait, on closer look, you -are- already discussing the very same stuff in this very same thread.
I'd like to add my two cents. I've always loved controversial content. I think showing it is fighting it. You know the old tropes of how the villain "must not be named" but the heroes actually are not afraid to mention their true name and that makes the heroes stronger, because not saying the villain's name makes the villain stronger? That. It's exactly that. Show racism, show sexism, show the bad stuff, because to know it is to be able to fight it.

Hopefully I don't need to add that me adding violence or racism or even implied rape backstories does not mean I'm doing it WITHOUT the consent of my players first. That's a given. But I think that, unless someone is disturbed by a subject, anything is fair game even in a tabletop rpg setting. It's not the subject, it's definitely all in how you handle it.

 

[Morrus]

I don't know - I've spoken to WOTC directly, and they have not indicated any problem with our content or presenations.

Well that's new. Personal review and permission to use WotC's logo and trade dress? For those who might want the same service from WotC, who did you speak to? Folks are gonna jump on that!

 

[Morrus]

Oooooh juicy comment, this makes me want to open a discussion on the concept of race in D&D and similar fantasy sci-fi settings. Personally, I love me some racism and sexism in my campaigns. It's like, you know, your players fight against those things. Which is cool.

I'd love to open a thread, but I wonder 1) if the mods allow it; 2) if the subject hasn't already been beaten to death here.

Oh god, no thanks. Not again. I think the first million identical closed threads were enough.