Fireball that leaves people still standing.Starting with fireball doesn’t sound like low fantasy.
Depends on who you hit with it, really. At 8d6 damage that averages 28. Looking at CR3 monsters, that's anywhere from most their hit points to half their hit points from one attack. As it's an AoE, it's designed for use against more creatures...which means more, lower CR nasties...which means you're increasingly likely to wipe them out...with one shot. That's not low fantasy. At all.Fireball that leaves people still standing.
I guess it depends on what you consider low fantasy.Starting with fireball doesn’t sound like low fantasy.
Yeah, fireball abandons balance for branding.Depends on who you hit with it, really. At 8d6 damage that averages 28. Looking at CR3 monsters, that's anywhere from most their hit points to half their hit points from one attack. As it's an AoE, it's designed for use against more creatures...which means more, lower CR nasties...which means you're increasingly likely to wipe them out...with one shot. That's not low fantasy. At all.
A 120ft range, 20ft radius sphere, for 8d6 fire damage, DEX save for half, fire goes around corners and ignites anything flammable. It's the single most OP spell for its level. Even the designers have flat out stated it is and intentionally so. Being able to do that twice a day without cost. That's not low fantasy. At all.
To me the important part of that sentence is "in D&D". Other RPGs have mechanically defined penalties like actual wounds in ways that D&D never has and even Level Drain was pretty simplistic.To me, those other risks only matter in D&D if death is also on the table.
I would argue this a bit. In my monster database, the 56 CR3 creatures range from 30-90 hp, averaging 56, with the distribution shown below:Depends on who you hit with it, really. At 8d6 damage that averages 28. Looking at CR3 monsters, that's anywhere from most their hit points to half their hit points from one attack.
I think somewhere between how the wiki and TVTropes articles define it is about right. A grounded, mundane humanocentric setting with little to no magic.I guess it depends on what you consider low fantasy.
Low magic. As is rare.Is the "low" part because of the level of perceived power? rarity? both? or something else?
Sure. Low fantasy would be something like an E1 or 2...with half or more of the casters removed, and half or more of the spells removed, and drastically increased costs of acquiring and casting spells. Gritty realism resting. Etc.You can certainly have a fireball in low fantasy, IF having one is significant in power, rare, both, or... well, something else.
Well, I’ll go with the designers rather than an opinion poll.A while ago I had a poll about the power of spells and their respective levels. 3rd level spells was the baseline for what was considered "powerful", but a larger cluster was also present at 5th level, and others even higher.
Sure. Sounds about right to me. The bar for peasants seeing magic would be quite low in a low fantasy setting. It would be more that the vast majority have never seen any real magic. Rumors and whispers and old wives’ tales, absolutely.I often ask "Would the typical commoner in your setting commonly have seen a fireball spell?" For me, the answer is certainly "no". Possible, sure, but the vast majority of commoners would never see or experience spells of 3rd level of higher. Such a thing would be likely be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, a tale to tell your grandchildren about. Now, that is different from knowing about the spell, and that could be another issue of considering a setting low fantasy.
So 30 - 28 isn’t most? Okay. And 58 - 28 isn’t half? Okay.I would argue this a bit. In my monster database, the 56 CR3 creatures range from 30-90 hp, averaging 56, with the distribution shown below:
View attachment 152757
Even assuming a failed save, the 28 points of damage (while certainly significant) for CR 3 would not be "most their hit points to half their hit points."
I opened MotM, found three CR3 monsters and went with those numbers. The extra data points don’t really refute that.Yes, if you decrease the CR, such as CR 1, a failed fireball would (given the average HP of CR 1 creatures) have a good chance of taking them out with one spell.
To be clear, I am not refuting your point, just thinking you were a bit over zealous in your estimations for CR 3 creatures.
So, high level magic is certainly possible in a low fantasy game for you?Low magic. As is rare.
Then random chance led to you a poor claim:I opened MotM, found three CR3 monsters and went with those numbers. The extra data points don’t really refute that.
It is, more properly:Looking at CR3 monsters, that's anywhere from most their hit points to half their hit points from one attack.