D&D (2024) If short rest abilities become Prof # tiimes per day?

[doctorbadwolf]

Changing Fighter (particularly BM) and Warlock short rest ability recharge to prof times per day probably wouldn't be excessive, as long as you don't allow everything to be used in the same fight. Even just requiring an action to refresh the abilities would reduce the nova potential and set up meaningful tactical choices.

Honestly making all short rest stuff able to be recovered as an action PB/LR works fine. Probably the easiest way to go. Just note that it can be done as part of a short rest, keep short rests as a healing resource usage gate but make them shorter as the core rule with longer short rests turned into the variant, and the game runs like a dream.

Stuff like the warlock would require more specific wording otherwise, perhaps a table.

Which is why I don't actually think we will see the end of short rests. It's doable, but pushes the game over the line into "needs conversion to work together" territory, if you get rid of short rests altogether. I don't think that any significant general rules will change.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

For some context, this change is what the Tasha's Subclass options, the Monsters of the Multiverse Race changes, and all the options in the Setting books since Ravenloft have done. The Monk and Warlock, if they went full proficiency Bonus organization, would be a significant surface level change...but not really a mathematical change from the assumed Adventure Day, which just means those Classes would no longer be swingy depending on whether they were allowed to take a nap or not.

This is very true, but does require a specific variant rule for each such class. I don't think they'll go that far.

Maybe instead, they'll say that a short rest can be done as an action, PB/LR. That way, you've got full compatibility with the PHB, no need for any conversion at all.

 

[Parmandur]

Honestly making all short rest stuff able to be recovered as an action PB/LR works fine. Probably the easiest way to go. Just note that it can be done as part of a short rest, keep short rests as a healing resource usage gate but make them shorter as the core rule with longer short rests turned into the variant, and the game runs like a dream.

Stuff like the warlock would require more specific wording otherwise, perhaps a table.

Which is why I don't actually think we will see the end of short rests. It's doable, but pushes the game over the line into "needs conversion to work together" territory, if you get rid of short rests altogether. I don't think that any significant general rules will change.

Yeah, I think you have a point. I do think Warlocks and Monks will see some serious tinkering to make them more "tableproof" like other Classes.

 

[Parmandur]

This is very true, but does require a specific variant rule for each such class. I don't think they'll go that far.

Maybe instead, they'll say that a short rest can be done as an action, PB/LR. That way, you've got full compatibility with the PHB, no need for any conversion at all.

I mean, we are looking at a new PHB, in all likelihood (or maybe something wild like a Neo-Rules Cyclopedia), so yeah, I am sort of expecting new write-ups of the Classes as new variant modules that are still "fully compatible" across tables if desired. But you make some good points, and we will see what goes down.

 

[payn]

Weird. I though people didn't want classes to be on the same resorce recovery system because it would make classes too samey.

I really liked the change from X per day in 3E, to X per rounds in PF1. Though, I prefer having a full days worth of resources to manage as opposed to encounter power mechanics. No need for short rests in that system.

They went ahead an added encounter powers to PF2 with short rests and its a mini game nightmare. I think I like undrave's suggestion best if you have to have variable recovery systems.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I mean, we are looking at a new PHB, in all likelihood (or maybe something wild like a Neo-Rules Cyclopedia), so yeah, I am sort of expecting new write-ups of the Classes as new variant modules that are still "fully compatible" across tables if desired. But you make some good points, and we will see what goes down.

I think that putting, eg, the Monk on a different resource recovery track entirely, would go way outside of what most people consider compatible. Especially considering the subclasses are balanced around the PHB Monk, and deleting short rests from the system would effectively make all subclasses from Tasha's or earlier non-combatible with the new presentation of the Monk. That would be....bad.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Yeah, I think you have a point. I do think Warlocks and Monks will see some serious tinkering to make them more "tableproof" like other Classes.

Yeah this I agree with. I think their primary guidepost, though, will be that they work with both the new PHB and the 2014 PHB. That whole, don't invalidate people's past purchases, thing. Even Volo's and Mordenkeinen's they've avoided actually invalidating.

I really hope they go with something as elegant as allowing recovery of those resources by taking a breath after an encounter X/Day, with language similar to Star Wars Saga Edition (which they've borrowed from extensively, btw, and not just indirectly by way of 4e), rather than rewriting the resource recovery of multiple classes.

 

[Parmandur]

I think that putting, eg, the Monk on a different resource recovery track entirely, would go way outside of what most people consider compatible. Especially considering the subclasses are balanced around the PHB Monk, and deleting short rests from the system would effectively make all subclasses from Tasha's or earlier non-combatible with the new presentation of the Monk. That would be....bad.

Well, you make a good point about healing and hit Dice mechanics. But if they do keep Short Rests from that, then someone could easily show up with a Way of the Elements Monk from 2014 and play at a 2024 table next to a 2024 Monk (or Monk equivalent: I hope they reflavor them hard), and it would work. I don't think that a given module has to plug directly into another to stay compatible: Paladin Subclasses don't work with Fighters, and I would still call the different Classes fully compatible. So, at a maximal level, I could see a set of basically new Classes inserted into the same rules framework.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Oh but this totally doesn't make everyone samey! We still have Vancian spellcasting, and only casters get at-wills cantrips.

imagine how pissed people would be if martial characters got at will exploits...

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I really like some short time (5 min, 1 action, something between) short rest that can be taken prof times per day.

That is a big power increase though at levels with 4 prof or higher (I assume few groups get 4 short rest or more)