D&D 5E Greyhawk: Why We Need Mo' Oerth by 2024

[JohnF]

It's the multiverse and spaceships, it's ninja nazi monks and demon-possessed emperors, it's endless black ice and dead civilizations blasted by colorless fire. It's a mechanical bejeweled songbird from 2 millenia ago, and an ancient computer designed by a long-ago Baron driven insane. It's a dark god dreaming within a crystalline cyst, and demi-gods raised from the ranks of mere mortal adventurers.

That’s the art order for the wrap around cover of the new Greyhawk setting book (if I was in charge). And it would kick off a “new” era of discovery as we move into the next iteration of the game.

The middle school kids I DM for would LOVE it!

 

[Vaalingrade]

And forgetting all of that: FIRST AND STILL BEST is also pretty good elevator pitch, especially because so much of Greyhawk is already in the zeitgeist.

The issue is you have to have something to prove it.

The only answers that seem to be forthcoming is 'There's stuff there, trust me'. Like are there examples?

What's the old school sci-fi stuff there? I would be interested in that, but I need to know what.

Someone mentioned the Rain of Colorless Fire earlier. Did that leave like a region where there's invisible fire everywhere and you could be on fire right now and might not even know it?

Are there concrete points of interest in the setting that aren't mystery boxen?

 

[Mort]

That’s the art order for the wrap around cover of the new Greyhawk setting book (if I was in charge). And it would kick off a “new” era of discovery as we move into the next iteration of the game.

The middle school kids I DM for would LOVE it!

I basically ran an adventure based on exactly this for my son's group (all 14) and it went over really well (he saw me running a 5e high level one shot for my group and wanted me to do it for his).

 

[Mort]

The issue is you have to have something to prove it.

The only answers that seem to be forthcoming is 'There's stuff there, trust me'. Like are there examples?

Again: human supremacist ninja Nazis not enough for you?

What's the old school sci-fi stuff there? I would be interested in that, but I need to know what.

But it's already been stated in this thread!

Crashed spaceship in the hills;

Demon posessed king expanding his empire;

Recently released Demigod, pissed off and expanding his empire/taking his rage out on everybody. So you basically have an incursion of demons, half-demons and other assorted demon offspring pushing toward and conquering everything. And it's not some future possibility like the dreaming dark in Eberron - it's happening right now and it's winning

Someone mentioned the Rain of Colorless Fire earlier. Did that leave like a region where there's invisible fire everywhere and you could be on fire right now and might not even know it?

Are there concrete points of interest in the setting that aren't mystery boxen?

As a matter of fact sort of. The rain of colorless fire left the Sea of Dust a desert land where things get weirder and weirder the farther you go in (so those invisible fire spots may well exist). Why would/does anyone go there? It was the homeplace of one of the most advanced/magical people's to have existed the ruins are filled with wonders from the past (and all the dangers thereof). One of my favorites (though I suspect not my players) the Suel Litch - instead of undead, they are spellcasters who have become parasites (kind of like the gould in stargate) and must steal bodies to live, which they eventually break down and must steal another body.

 

[Shardstone]

Take the Sea of Dust, do something with the spaceships in the hills other then saying they are there (because this has now been done so many times so as not to be interesting), and do literally anything with the Demon Empire that hasn't been done before (hard but not impossible), and Greyhawk may yet be interesting for new people in 2022.

Other than the Sea of Dust/Rain of Colorless Fire though, almost everything mentioned in this thread has been done by so many settings other than Greyhawk now that Greyhawk trying to cash in on them again is not interesting. I can't throw my shoe without hitting a setting with a dark evil empire or some threat that's about to end the world RIGHT NOW. And it isn't too hard to go and find a setting with spaceships, least of all since the Barrier Peaks is not a setting agnostic adventure put into the Yawning Portal. The undead leaching off other people I've seen many times before, the evil demigod I've seen before (I mean, Elden Ring JUST came out).

And this post isn't to say these things can't be done fresh and exciting for new audiences, but instead that they have to be because why would I spend money on this setting if I already have it??

 

[James Gasik]

See I don't recall this stuff being front and center, my experience with Greyhawk is you had to go out and find this stuff. Now I know, that's the point of D&D, but most other settings make it sound like the cool parts are out there everywhere.

Things like the spaceship or Dungeonland are kind of out of the way. It'd be like trying to say "hey, the Forgotten Realms has a land full of wizards with flying ships! ....though we don't have a sourcebook for it yet. Still working on the Sword Coast! But maybe in 6e!"

 

[Mort]

Take the Sea of Dust, do something with the spaceships in the hills other then saying they are there (because this has now been done so many times so as not to be interesting), and do literally anything with the Demon Empire that hasn't been done before (hard but not impossible), and Greyhawk may yet be interesting for new people in 2022.

Other than the Sea of Dust/Rain of Colorless Fire though, almost everything mentioned in this thread has been done by so many settings other than Greyhawk now that Greyhawk trying to cash in on them again is not interesting. I can't throw my shoe without hitting a setting with a dark evil empire or some threat that's about to end the world RIGHT NOW. And it isn't too hard to go and find a setting with spaceships, least of all since the Barrier Peaks is not a setting agnostic adventure put into the Yawning Portal. The undead leaching off other people I've seen many times before, the evil demigod I've seen before (I mean, Elden Ring JUST came out).

And this post isn't to say these things can't be done fresh and exciting for new audiences, but instead that they have to be because why would I spend money on this setting if I already have it??

It doesn't have to be completely new (very little is) it just has to be well integrated and executed.

 

[deganawida]

Not to derail or anything, but this thread is reminiscent of the conversation my wife and I had last night while re-watching "John Carter," which was that Burroughs invented all these neat things that have been endlessly aped by successors, to the point where viewers and reviewers viewed "John Carter" as derivative and a knock-off of things such as Star Wars and Superman. It's a crying shame, as the source material has merit aside from being the source (though you can likely see from the fact that I was re-watching the movie that I tend to go to the source material rather than derivatives).

 

[James Gasik]

Yes, I had that same problem when I took my friends to see John Carter. They complained because "that's all been done before" and I was like, you fools, John Carter did it all first!

It's like how, by the time the second Matrix came out, everyone had copied the first Matrix, so it didn't seem very revolutionary anymore.

 

[Shardstone]

It doesn't have to be completely new (very little is) it just has to be well integrated and executed.

Correct. I think we are both talking past each other at this point, and actually agree on the core premise.