D&D 5E Being strong and skilled is a magic of its own or, how I learned to stop worrying and love anime fightin' magic

[Maxperson]

that 14 year old girl is like a 1st level adventurer... and no one I know is suggesting a 1st level fighter should be able to solo orcus... but a 20th level 14 year old girl should be able

Right. He equated being able to swim the English Channel with being able to turn Orcus into a baseball bat. It was a bad analogy, but apparently he'd rather block me and avoid having a reasonable discussion than admit that.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Yes but again that is magical. It is just that magic is natural. Of course, you still need to ask, why isn't everyone doing this if it is so "natural."

Listen, I don't have any issue with a supernatural / superheroic / superpower lass that models that type of warrior. I think it can work within 5e (I've even made one and posted in April). Just don't pretend it is mundane.

I could climb a mountain with just my natural abilities, I can’t as i am right now but theoretically i could if i put in a boatload of training and gained a bunch of levels in a metaphorical ‘mountain climber’ class, sure so could everyone else too but few people actually do, an in the fantasy world the people who do are typically called adventurers.

 

[dave2008]

Are you suggesting a 14-year-old girl isn't a valid player character? Or are you saying girls are inferior?

Help me out here.

Max was suggesting neither, were did you get that idea from?

 

[dave2008]

I could climb a mountain with just my natural abilities, I can’t as i am right now but theoretically i could if i put in a boatload of training and gained a bunch of levels in a metaphorical ‘mountain climber’ class, sure so could everyone else too but few people actually do, an in the fantasy world the people who do are typically called adventurers.

That is not how it works in my fantasy world, but that is definitely plausible. However, like I said in the very post you quoted, I am fine with a 5e superhero class.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Right. He equated being able to swim the English Channel with being able to turn Orcus into a baseball bat. It was a bad analogy, but apparently he'd rather block me and avoid having a reasonable discussion than admit that.

no we are equating a heroic exceptional individual as a beginning level adventurer... by level 10 swimming that should be a relaxing day compaired to what they can do...

 

[payn]

Why change the damage of Fireball? It's pretty easy, really. The spell has been doing the same 1d6 per caster level since...well forever! Outside of when it kept scaling past level 10, the spell has barely changed over decades.

And uh, I just want to point out, monster hit points have increased dramatically while player damage really hasn't. Swords still do a d8. Ability score bonuses have gotten weaker over the years (remember when an 18*00 gave you +6 damage? Or when players could have scores above 20 without magic items?).

Fireball does 8d6 (8-48 damage) to a Challenge Rating 5 Troll in 5e. A Troll has 84 hit points.

Fireball does 5d6 (5-30 damage) to a Troll in 1e. A Troll has 33 hit points.

I would say, if anything, Fireball should do more than 8d6 damage to keep up with monster hit point inflation.

It was a comparison of fireball to other spells of the same level. Also, it was a comparison to what a fighter can do that's similar, which is nothing.

Lightning bolt does the same but you enemies have to approach you in line formation to get the same effect.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Max was suggesting neither, were did you get that idea from?

because what makes a 14 year old girl any less viable as a 1st level fighter? we didn't suggest she was going to fight epic threats... just that she was exceptional... he then jumped to "well if she can't do it why can a 20th level fighter?:

 

[Zubatcarteira]

Was thinking about the crazy things PCs could do without explicit magic, in no particular order:

• Evasion lets Monks, Rogues and Hunter Rangers dodge ridiculous things, like fireballs that engulf an entire room, lightning from clouds, meteors explosions, comets strikes that hit like a nuke, and take no damage.
• Monks have Deflect Missile, and there are stats for automatic rifles in the DMG, so a Monk could just catch an AK-47's bullet out of the air, or dodge its burts fire entirely with Evasion.
• Every character can be poisoned, stabbed, lit on fire, bathed in acid, etc, then rest for an hour and be completely fine.
• With enough HP you can survive ridiculous things like falling from a plane, being hit by a meteor, having a flying fortress crash on you, or be bitten by a moon-sized creature.
• Kill creatures that can survive the things above in 20-ish seconds.
• Fight blindfolded with the Blind Fighting fighting style, and punch as hard as a warhammer with the Unarmed Fighting style, since level 1.

There's prob more, but you can get the gist. They already can do crazy stuff, just need to get that and apply to cool active things the player can choose.

 

[Haplo781]

Was thinking about the crazy things PCs could do without explicit magic, in no particular order:

• Evasion lets Monks, Rogues and Hunter Rangers dodge ridiculous things, like fireballs that engulf an entire room, lightning from clouds, meteors explosions, comets strikes that hit like a nuke, and take no damage.
• Monks have Deflect Missile, and there are stats for automatic rifles in the DMG, so a Monk could just catch an AK-47's bullet out of the air, or dodge its burts fire entirely with Evasion.
• Every character can be poisoned, stabbed, lit on fire, bathed in acid, etc, then rest for an hour and be completely fine.
• With enough HP you can survive ridiculous things like falling from a plane, being hit by a meteor, having a flying fortress crash on you, or be bitten by a moon-sized creature.
• Kill creatures that can survive the things above in 20-ish seconds.
• Fight blindfolded with the Blind Fighting fighting style, and punch as hard as a warhammer with the Unarmed Fighting style, since level 1.

There's prob more, but you can get the gist. They already can do crazy stuff, just need to get that and apply to cool active things the player can choose.

Yeah. Opposition to fighters and rogues doing awesome stuff isn't based on "realism" or "being grounded". It's a lie they tell themselves.

They just don't want the game to evolve.

 

[payn]

Yeah. Opposition to fighters and rogues doing awesome stuff isn't based on "realism" or "being grounded". It's a lie they tell themselves.

They just don't want the game to evolve.

Right, because all those things are possible at level 1.