D&D (2024) Ranger playtest discussion

[Ruin Explorer]

The amount of work to convert it from spell to mundane class feature would be astonishingly small.

I agree. So the question is, why didn't they do that? Loads of other Martials and even loads of Ranger subclasses have abilities to do a small amount of extra damage like that without it being a spell. If anything, it's the norm.

So why did they make Rangers have to spam a weird concentration-free, always-known (but not always active!) version of a spell? It doesn't fit the theme. It's not tradition. It's just weird.

My feeling is it's essentially "trolling" from WotC to see how people react. If there's no pushback they're likely to keep going with this sort of "let's make non-magical stuff into spells".

 

[Branduil]

The more I think about it, the more I think that 50% of the problems people have with a spellcasting Ranger could be solved if they just put in a ribbon explaining how Ranger spellcasting is different and making it more in line with both people's mental image and the lore.

The other 50% could be solved by taking out the weird damage-dealing spells like Hunter's Mark and Conjure Volley and just making them Ranger features, like they really should be in the first place. This will also make it easier for the features to not just suck horribly like Conjure Volley since they don't have to balance half-caster spells with full casters.

 

[Olrox17]

I agree. So the question is, why didn't they do that? Loads of other Martials and even loads of Ranger subclasses have abilities to do a small amount of extra damage like that without it being a spell. If anything, it's the norm.

So why did they make Rangers have to spam a weird concentration-free, always-known (but not always active!) version of a spell? It doesn't fit the theme. It's not tradition. It's just weird.

My feeling is it's essentially "trolling" from WotC to see how people react. If there's no pushback they're likely to keep going with this sort of "let's make non-magical stuff into spells".

I wouldn't call it trolling, because of the negative connotations of using that word, but yeah, they are testing if they can get away with turning every feature that is even slightly complex into an existing spell. The Hunter's Conjure Barrage = Multiattack is an obvious example.

The more I think about it, the more I think that 50% of the problems people have with a spellcasting Ranger could be solved if they just put in a ribbon explaining how Ranger spellcasting is different and making it more in line with both people's mental image and the lore.

The other 50% could be solved by taking out the weird damage-dealing spells like Hunter's Mark and Conjure Volley and just making them Ranger features, like they really should be in the first place. This will also make it easier for the features to not just suck horribly like Conjure Volley since they don't have to balance half-caster spells with full casters.

I think that would be an acceptable compromise.

 

[Minigiant]

I agree. So the question is, why didn't they do that? Loads of other Martials and even loads of Ranger subclasses have abilities to do a small amount of extra damage like that without it being a spell. If anything, it's the norm.

So why did they make Rangers have to spam a weird concentration-free, always-known (but not always active!) version of a spell? It doesn't fit the theme. It's not tradition. It's just weird.

My feeling is it's essentially "trolling" from WotC to see how people react. If there's no pushback they're likely to keep going with this sort of "let's make non-magical stuff into spells".

It feels like a combination of trolling and fear.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

It feels like a combination of trolling and fear.

Fear of what though?

 

[Bill Zebub]

It feels like a combination of trolling and fear.

Feels like market testing and optimism to me.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Fear of what though?

Fear of affecting their bottom line.

 

[Minigiant]

Fear of what though?

The post publication discussion of rangers was a mess. I don't think they are not scarred from it.

 

[Bill Zebub]

The post publication discussion of rangers was a mess. I don't think they are not scarred from it.

I’m not sure “scarred” is the right term for a division that is smashing records, crushing Amazon rankings, and single-handedly driving the profits of a large corporation.

 

[Minigiant]

I’m not sure “scarred” is the right term for a division that is smashing records, crushing Amazon rankings, and single-handedly driving the profits of a large corporation.

One doesn't exclude the other.

After the mystic, ranger, and monk, WOTC went through hell in subsystem design.